Jump to content
Julia Mae

Why Does Moriarty Hold a Grudge Against Sherlock?

Recommended Posts

I've always thought IOU meant just what it means: "I owe you." 

 

photo.jpg

 

Here is what I think of as Moriarty's clear visual statement: IOU on black raptor's wings.  The Moriarty coat of arms is a black raptor on a silver field.

 

He says it so many ways,  "This is between you and me, Sherlock."  It's personal.

 

I think we need to look back here:

 

photo.jpg

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Wow, so early on Sherlock made a deduction that had some kind of an affect on Moriarty's whole family. A crime committed by Moriarty's parent (s) or some leading member of the Moriarty clan? It had to be bigger then a kid drowning in a pool especially since the crime was never solved....

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Wow, so early on Sherlock made a deduction that had some kind of an affect on Moriarty's whole family. A crime committed by Moriarty's parent (s) or some leading member of the Moriarty clan? It had to be bigger then a kid drowning in a pool especially since the crime was never solved....

 

There's a complete theory here: Holmes/Moriarty Connnection.

 

Briefly -

MycroftSherlockSIPblogwords.jpg

 

Mummy was upset and the boys blame each other and there is a huge rift between them.  Mycroft had to "play mother" during Sherlock's  childhood. (ASIB) 

 

Moriarty has been after Sherlock since S1E1 and Sherlock "had no idea" what Moriarty meant.

Without going into all the detail, my idea is:

 

 

 

See also Tale of the Killer Cabbie for more.  From that post:

 

"In any case, Sherlock must not be shot.  He must be one of the suicides. Moriarty wanted more than his death, only Sherlock's defeat would earn the final payment.  The words from the cabbie's mouth are Moriarty's, the method to entice him, appeal to both his ego and his inherent reckless disregard for his own safety.  He'll risk not breathing for the sake of "brain-work" because "breathing is boring." 

 

Starting at the beginning, why did that cabbie seek out Sherlock at all, much less at his flat?  He had no reason to think Sherlock would find him, he drove away after Sherlock  dismissed him.  

 

Yet, he put himself at risk, trying to conquer and kill Sherlock Holmes in a way which would humiliate him in memory and invalidate his reputation.   The great Sherlock Holmes would fall victim to a funny little man driving a cab.  It foreshadows "The Reichenbach Fall", where Sherlock "will die in disgrace."  Of course, that's the point of this, James tells him. 

 

 

And if the words in the cabbie's mouth are Moriarty's, it's a very small leap to that cabbie actually being Moriarty.

 

Recall what Sherlock said to him, "Either way, you're wasted as a cabbie."  True.  Because  he wasn't a cabbie at all. 

 

Moriarty.  So much more than just a man.  What's more than a man?  A family.  A clan.

 

The Killer Cabbie may have been a man with an aneurism, he also is easily cast as the senior Moriarty, a proper genius, father to James, the original "Professor Moriarty," intent on destroying the son of Holmes senior, his enemy.   Moriarty plays the role of the "funny little man driving a cab" well, right down to the shaving foam on his neck.  Why?  Always the question for Moriarty in any form: why are you doing this?  What's it all for?

 

(Note how James plays gay right down to the brand of underwear he makes sure is visible. And fools Sherlock.)

   

 

Recall Gatiss in the commentary hints at Sherlock's father possibly having an affair.  Even without that, something really upset the hell out of Mummy.

 

Who did Holmes Senior possibly run off with?  The only woman we've seen who makes a good candidate is the one torn from the picture of the Killer Cabbie's children. cabbiekidsdvdedit.JPGWas it an affair?  Or did Holmes Senior  disappear with her to rescue her and her children from a psychopathic husband and father who helped one of his children murder another child?

 

Who would have put Holmes Senior onto the crime?  Sherlock, the boy genius who knew Carl Powers' shoes would have been with his clothes.   Sherlock said, "I made a fuss, I tried to get the police interested, but nobody seemed to think it was important."  Perhaps his father listened to him more carefully than he knew.

 

Mycroft somehow blames Sherlock for whatever happened, for what made him have to assume an adult's role at home and "play mother" to Sherlock. 

 

Even assuming the senior Holmes didn't share his investigation of the Carl Powers case with his son, it's easy to imagine the hyper-astute Sherlock noting behavior patterns and physical evidence that would lead him to perhaps blurt out that his father was keeping company with another woman.  If Holmes senior left, it could have led to the breakdown of his wife, or even her suicide. 

 

If Mycroft blames Sherlock for being the catalyst that started the reactions leading to the breakdown of the family, Moriarty senior and the child psychopath James, the boy taken from his father's side, surely also blame him.

It was personal from the very beginning. 

 

Where would James, as a child, obtain C. botulinum bacteria? 
Depends on what kind of "professor" his father was. 
 
Mycroftsherlockcommentary.JPG
  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Since this discussion seemed to be developing a life of its own, I have given it its own thread.

 

Julia Mae, if you don't care for the title I gave it, you can change it at any time by editing your initial post.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Since this discussion seemed to be developing a life of its own, I have given it its own thread.

 

Julia Mae, if you don't care for the title I gave it, you can change it at any time by editing your initial post.

 

I think you and the title are perfect, such a good idea so that our other OP can explore her ideas without everything getting tangled up.

 

Thank you for going to so much work.  Hey, maybe you should think about just  deleting my big long post from that thread  to keep it nice for the OP.  Wait.  Maybe I still can..... oh you did already.  Excellent.  I couldn't delete my last response, they let me hide it, though.

 

IF we were to agree that something must have happened in the past, I'd be really interested in some other ideas that take into account the time frame and the Carl Powers murder. 

 

Problem is, Gatiss really loves backstory and Moffat really doesn't and we might never get back there.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

It really does sound plausible.

 

I am surprised it even sounds comprehensible, as I scavenged it from a much longer post.

 

I have been accused on more than one occasion of thinking too much.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Unlike anyone else around here   :D

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

... maybe you should think about just  deleting my big long post from that thread  to keep it nice for the OP.  Wait.  Maybe I still can..... oh you did already.  Excellent.  I couldn't delete my last response, they let me hide it, though.

I didn't delete it, I moved it to this new thread. If your other (now hidden) post would have fit in here, I apologize for not bringing it over as well, but I somehow didn't notice it. (Maybe I was already in the process of splitting off this thread when you posted it.)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Oh no. The gist of it is clear. I had no problem following the main thought.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

WELL....

 

I put this video in another thread, but at minute 39:00, it looks like Mofftiss completely negate a very basic premise of many of my theories:

 

 

 

A woman asks the very question I would ask: How many Moriartys can there be?  "James" is never called "Professor."   It sounds to me like they are saying there was only one Moriarty and he is dead.   This would, of course, fly a bit in the face of the Canon, where he has a brother.  It's only a minute of interview if anyone wants to take a look.

 

Interestingly, Gatiss speaks about things in early drafts of The Great Game where Moriarty's schoolyard nickname is "Prof."  And what Carl Powers makes fun of that gets him killed.  

 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Since "Jim" is the Moriarty who was involved in Sherlock's "Reichenbach fall," I've always taken him to be this adaptation's counterpart to the canon's Professor Moriarty -- which does leave the Colonel as a future option, regardless of what Moftiss are currently thinking (or saying).  Will definitely have to play that video, though!

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I have no idea why Moriarty is so fixated on Sherlock (apart from the fact that Sherlock seems to be his first "worthy" opponent, which must of course be exciting, but then, the same could be said for Mycroft, and Moriarty doesn't seem to have a particular "thing" about him). All we know is that they go pretty far back. Moriarty, it turns out, killed Carl Powers, and Sherlock regards this as the case where he "began". It is very unlikely a coincidence that Moriarty chooses Carl's story to get the game with Sherlock going. He must have known, or found out later when he was researching Sherlock, that this story had a personal significance to his opponent.

 

Now, if Moriarty would turn out to be "the other one" (or to have been, which I would much prefer), then of course there'd be a whole other multitude of possibilities. I don't think this is the solution, but I must admit I still really like the idea. It only works as a theory though if one assumes Sherlock does not know he has another brother at all, or thinks the "other one" is dead. There certainly have been no hints whatsoever that he thinks Moriarty might be related to him.

 

Moriarty creeps me out. He seems very unreal, as if he truly did come straight from the realm of fairy tales, and not the kind I'd like as a bedtime story. If John hadn't seen him being his crazy self at the pool, I would suspect they'd gone with the theory that Moriarty is a (perhaps drug-induced) figment of Holmes' imagination. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

Now, if Moriarty would turn out to be "the other one" (or to have been, which I would much prefer), then of course there'd be a whole other multitude of possibilities. I don't think this is the solution, but I must admit I still really like the idea. It only works as a theory though if one assumes Sherlock does not know he has another brother at all, or thinks the "other one" is dead. There certainly have been no hints whatsoever that he thinks Moriarty might be related to him.

 

Maybe Sherlock thinks there's only two Holmes brothers, and only two. If that's true, then you can't assume that he thinks there's an other one, dead or alive. And if Moriarty is the other one, and Sherlock doesn't know it, then we could infer that Sherlock's either under selective amnesia or he blocked out all memories of Moriarty being his brother.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Or never knew in the first place. The other one could have been removed from the household when S. was only two, for some reason. Or Moriarty's undergone significant reconstructive surgery (in an Irish hospital, thus the accent.) :) Or.... uh....

 

I always thought MoriarT zoomed in on S because S is the one who kept messing about in his business. The cabbie & Gen'l Shan being the latest such examples. He didn't bother with Mycroft because Myc didn't bother with him ("he seems desperate to get my attention" -- implying that the attention was still to be gotten.....) Myc seems to be focused on loftier things than mere criminals.

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I don't think Mycroft would be interesting enough for Moriarty.  He's too buttoned up, too stiff, too controlled.  You can't push his buttons the way you can Sherlock.  Sherlock has an element of unpredictability to him that I would think Mycroft would find interesting.

  • Like 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Right, he's fascinated by Sherlock because he thinks they're somehow the same -- ?? And vice versa.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I have no idea why Moriarty is so fixated on Sherlock (apart from the fact that Sherlock seems to be his first "worthy" opponent, which must of course be exciting, but then, the same could be said for Mycroft, and Moriarty doesn't seem to have a particular "thing" about him). All we know is that they go pretty far back. Moriarty, it turns out, killed Carl Powers, and Sherlock regards this as the case where he "began"....

Sherlock told John that he had tried to raise a fuss over Carl's missing shoes, but no one would listen. Perhaps Moriarty heard about it, though, and that's when he first decided that Sherlock was his enemy.

 

Regarding the video -- the first three minutes are just musical filler.  The question that Julia Mae mentioned occurs at about 39 minutes in.  The early-draft bit that she mentioned Gatiss referring to is that Carl Powers had laughed at Moriarty's asteroid theory (which is a reference to one of the canon Professor's writings).   And one of the other questioners is wearing the same tee-shirt I have (a heart-shaped section of The Wallpaper with the yellow smiley superimposed). When Sue Vertue compliments her on the shirt, she says that she made it. So she's the gal who designed my shirt -- cool!

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Are you sure that Moriarty hold a grudge against Sherlock? It could be simply because out of the two Holmes brothers, Sherlock is the capricious one and thus more enjoyable to play with than his boring older sibling. :P A game with Sherlock will afford Moriarty with more audience in literal sense and appeal to his inner showmanship compared with silent, behind the screen war that surely would occur should he target Mycroft directly.

 

Moriarty is one of the most complex characters in the series. He was not Sherlock on the side of the devils nor he was a cruel machine with tendency for showing off. It is a real pleasure to try to get a peek into his mind.

  • Like 4

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Are you sure that Moriarty hold a grudge against Sherlock? It could be simply because out of the two Holmes brothers, Sherlock is the capricious one and thus more enjoyable to play with than his boring older sibling. :P A game with Sherlock will afford Moriarty with more audience in literal sense and appeal to his inner showmanship compared with silent, behind the screen war that surely would occur should he target Mycroft directly.

Well, the "IOU" messages imply some kind of grudge. But I agree, in some sense Jim just wanted to "play" with Sherlock because it was fun to do so. And because Sherlock took the bait and played back.

  • Like 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The strange thing about the IOU motif is that the last time it's mentioned in TRF is when John's at Sherlock's grave and says, "I was so alone, and I owe you so much." And in John's account of TGG on his blog, he writes:

 

 

The voice in my ear ... told me to say some stuff - which, I realised, gave the impression that I was behind it all. That I, John Watson, was Moriarty. I could see the look in Sherlock's eyes - a flash of, not anger, but hurt. For a second, he looked like a little, lost child.

 

So is the last repeat of the IOU motif a nod to this statement in John's blog? Or is it something more?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
:blink::wacko:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Probably used as recurrent theme but with different meanings. I.O.U generally mean an acknowledgement of debt but what if according to Jim's mind (someone who is not exactly a devoted follower of societal conventions)  it also can stand for, "I Own U / You Are Mine"?

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

  • Who's Online   0 Members, 0 Anonymous, 15 Guests (See full list)

    There are no registered users currently online

×

Important Information

By using this site, you agree to our Terms of UseWe have placed cookies on your device to help make this website better. You can adjust your cookie settings, otherwise we'll assume you're okay to continue.Privacy PolicyGuidelines.