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Arcadia

Myers-Briggs personality types -- and quiz

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4 hours ago, Van Buren Supernova said:

The shitty friends I have, the more I reject pictures, the more they take it as challenge. 

That's how my boyfriend was.  So I finally learned to more or less ignore him if he had a camera in his hands (while making sure to have a pleasant expression on my face).

So which MB type are you, VBS?

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On ‎8‎/‎26‎/‎2019 at 2:45 PM, Carol the Dabbler said:

Aren't you an INTP/J yourself, Arcadia? 

INTP, yes, but I don't recognize myself in most of what you mention (altho it's possible some people find me intimidating but I'm too clueless to notice.) But the reaction I have to discovering I've done something (or haven't done something) that other people don't consider "normal" … I think that's pretty universal. I think most people feel overlooked, misunderstood, taken for granted, superior, inferior, smart, dumb, whatever, at various points in their lives. Such feelings do not, however, make us either special, or singled-out, or even a particular personality type. Imo.

I always thought the main point of the Myers-Briggs test was to help co-workers (or others) communicate better with each other, rather than making a big deal out of the differences between us. However, my boss at the time thought it meant that we all had to learn to be more like her, so what do I know. :P 

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I think the point is to understand ourselves better, to realize that just because we're different doesn't mean we're wrong (or they're wrong), just that we have a different way of looking at things -- which is good, because having more than one viewpoint helps us consider a variety of options.

I never thought I was intimidating at all, but I've been told that a time or two.  One of my college roommates claimed that the first thing I ever said to her was "I sure hope you don't like to study with the radio on."

 

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21 hours ago, Carol the Dabbler said:

I think the point is to understand ourselves better, to realize that just because we're different doesn't mean we're wrong (or they're wrong), just that we have a different way of looking at things -- which is good, because having more than one viewpoint helps us consider a variety of options.

Yeah, I don't think my boss was interested in a variety of options, just her options. And she's the one who set up the Myers-Briggs workshops in the first place. People are weird, aren't they we? :D 

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Is anyone familiar with this site?

https://introvertdear.com/

It's an online refuge/article library which celebrates the Introverts on the MBTI

I've been an I all my life, decidedly INFP when I was younger.  In recent years, I've been coming out INFJ on occasion.  I chalk it up to a 20 year career in public services . . and just maturity . . seeing some of the worst of man's inhumanity to man has contributed to making me more Judgmental, maybe.  :)

INFP/INFJ are very close in many respects, often overlapping in traits.  An article I read here illuminated the difference perfectly:

Js tend exhibit more external organizational structure/rigidity when it comes to routines and systems, imposing external order on what they feel is their internal mess.

Ps tend to cheerfully acknowledge that they can be slobs but will always choose chasing butterflies or the like over filing and housework.  

The article states:  "If you look more together than you feel, you are probably an IJ.

If you feel more together than you look, you are probably an IP.

*******

Well.  If adherence to neatness and routine alone are considered, I'm still firmly an IP.  My attitude is, nobody on her deathbed is going to say "D@mn I wish I'd done more housework!"  Missing out on some beautiful days outside or the opportunities to do fun/social things with friends and loved ones will be much more regrettable.

My clutter does cause me stress.  I enthusiastically embrace the minimalist lifestyle--in my mind--but the physical reality of having to get rid of my stuff is overwhelming.  I usually  have to lie down after I've contemplated it for too long.

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21 minutes ago, Hikari said:

Well.  If adherence to neatness and routine alone are considered, I'm still firmly an IP.  My attitude is, nobody on her deathbed is going to say "D@mn I wish I'd done more housework!"  Missing out on some beautiful days outside or the opportunities to do fun/social things with friends and loved ones will be much more regrettable.

My clutter does cause me stress.  I enthusiastically embrace the minimalist lifestyle--in my mind--but the physical reality of having to get rid of my stuff is overwhelming.  I usually  have to lie down after I've contemplated it for too long.

Hear hear! 

The boss I mentioned above was an extreme J, and I, of course, was at the opposite end of the spectrum. Hence her declaration that I should try to be more like her. I kept threatening to get a bumper sticker that said, "I'm a P and Proud of it!" :D 

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My supervisor is only 5 months older than me, so we have all the same frames of reference as kids who were children in the '70s and were in high school in the 1980s.  We both studied education, worked as teachers and now are librarians.

I am an INFP,  Dreamer, Messy Desk inhabitor, adventurer, animal lover, Libra.  I can really get lost in my own head and my capacity for compassion over suffering is sometimes incapacitating due to the often sorrowful world we inhabit.

She is a Taurus, the bull, and she can be bull-headed.  She's loud and extroverted.  Pragmatic.  Slobbers all over human babies but could really give a toss about animals.  Definitely more of a regimented person than I, and her desk/office is pristine.  Her personal planner is color-coded and crammed with appointments . . . a quick glance at it, and it could be a Allied playbook for the D-Day invasion.  She does not leave anything to chance, this woman.  Whereas, spontaneity is my middle name.  She's got next year's vacation booked and itinerized within an inch of it's life.  I don't know what I'm having for lunch . . in three hours.  

If I have to MBTI her I'd say ESFJ.  We've got F in common.  She can be selectively compassionate, but also very moody and she plays obvious favorites.  I am not in that category; she prefers women like her--married and extremely organized.  I'm neither.

This is a fascinating subject.  I just took the test again (2 different ones).  INFP again.  I aspire to more J-ness  . . I would feel more adult, possibly.  

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3 hours ago, Hikari said:

The article states:  "If you look more together than you feel, you are probably an IJ.

If you feel more together than you look, you are probably an IP.

What if you don't look together or feel together?  :P

I'm a J, though not to an extreme.  But I relate a lot to INTP's (and INFJ's, and to a lesser extent ISTJ's).  INTJ isn't a perfect fit for me either, but still the best fit and the result I usually get on tests.

I'm not a clean freak, but I like to organize, and I try to stay organized as I go by cleaning up after myself and putting things back in their place right away.  For instance, if I'm making a salad and finish up the salad bag, the bag goes in the trash right then, before I eat, and doesn't sit out on the counter waiting to be thrown away.  When I take off my dirty clothes, into the hamper they go.  Papers are in one or two neat piles, and will stay in a neat pile until I get around to going through them and organizing them into whatever categories they belong in.  If I let a mess build up, it will take me forever to get around to it because it just feels overwhelming.  I don't mind if other people are messy, as long as it's constrained to their own areas.  If their mess starts drifting over into my area, I'll eventually say something, because clutter stresses me out.

What's a bit funny is that even though INTJ's are J's, externally they often appear more disorganized, like P's (though some P's are messier than others, just like J's).

My most extreme trait is Introversion.  I'm about as introverted as it gets.  I'm aware of Introvert Dear, in fact I think they have a Tumblr blog that I follow, if I'm not mistaken... I also love Quiet Revolution, though I think their Facebook feed is better than the actual website.  (I follow Introvert Dear on FB too, though honestly I'm rarely ever on FB, and basically only have an account in the first place because my mother wouldn't stop hounding me about it, lol.)

 

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42 minutes ago, Artemis said:

What if you don't look together or feel together?  :P

I'm a J, though not to an extreme.  But I relate a lot to INTP's (and INFJ's, and to a lesser extent ISTJ's).  INTJ isn't a perfect fit for me either, but still the best fit and the result I usually get on tests.

I'm not a clean freak, but I like to organize, and I try to stay organized as I go by cleaning up after myself and putting things back in their place right away.  For instance, if I'm making a salad and finish up the salad bag, the bag goes in the trash right then, before I eat, and doesn't sit out on the counter waiting to be thrown away.  When I take off my dirty clothes, into the hamper they go.  Papers are in one or two neat piles, and will stay in a neat pile until I get around to going through them and organizing them into whatever categories they belong in.  If I let a mess build up, it will take me forever to get around to it because it just feels overwhelming.  I don't mind if other people are messy, as long as it's constrained to their own areas.  If their mess starts drifting over into my area, I'll eventually say something, because clutter stresses me out.

What's a bit funny is that even though INTJ's are J's, externally they often appear more disorganized, like P's (though some P's are messier than others, just like J's).

My most extreme trait is Introversion.  I'm about as introverted as it gets.  I'm aware of Introvert Dear, in fact I think they have a Tumblr blog that I follow, if I'm not mistaken... I also love Quiet Revolution, though I think their Facebook feed is better than the actual website.  (I follow Introvert Dear on FB too, though honestly I'm rarely ever on FB, and basically only have an account in the first place because my mother wouldn't stop hounding me about it, lol.)

 

Well, that describes me, pretty much.  The best I can manage is "I hope to God I look more together than I feel . . (But that's only because I'm hiding my Perceiver Slob shame and inner chaos, or hoping I can hide it.)

There are a number of books out on Introverts; I haven't read any of them.  The paradox of working full time in a busy urban library is that I read a lot more before I started working in a library.

I was a very introverted kid, but as I have gotten older, I have become more extroverted. I will never flock to a huge raucous party as my idea of a good time, but I've reached an age where I am shedding giving a F* of what other people think I 'should' be like or do.   I've lived on my own since  college and spent six years in a foreign country that I flew off to with about 10 words of the language and knowing no one.  Forcing myself out of my shell was a survival tactic . . but even though I crave the society others more than I used to, I routinely experience weekends during which the only human interaction I get in two days is with my barista at Starbucks.  If I were truly still a deep Introvert, I would like it this way, but I don't.  I've also learned  that I've got to advocate for myself because no one else is going to.  I've resolved to never deny myself an experience because I'll have to do it by myself.  I've traveled to two foreign countries by myself and am eying an expatriate retirement, because I"m not willing to say that all  my grand adventures are over.  I can't help what other people think or whether or not they want to hang with me or think I'm worth their friendship . . I have to forge ahead and do as much as I can solo.  

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I feel the same … that the years have had their way with me, and I am much less "strictly" an INTP than I used to be. My "T" was always close to the middle, and my I's and N's have slid that way. Still a pretty extreme P, though. And Proud of it. :smile: 

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10 hours ago, Hikari said:

The paradox of working full time in a busy urban library is that I read a lot more before I started working in a library.

Ha, I know what you mean.  I was working in a busy urban library and hardly read anything.  Still haven't gotten back in the habit, even though I've left the library behind.

10 hours ago, Hikari said:

I've reached an age where I am shedding giving a F* of what other people think I 'should' be like or do.  ...  I've also learned  that I've got to advocate for myself because no one else is going to.

It's interesting that for you, these experiences have made you more extroverted, while for me, it's what's allowed me to become more comfortable with my introversion.  Most of my family are extroverts who don't understand introverts, and generally view introversion as a character flaw.  My mother especially was/is always criticizing and shaming me for it, and trying to force me into extroverted behavior.  It damaged my self-confidence a lot when I was growing up, and continued to into my mid-late 20's.  Part of my learning not to give a crap what other people think has involved learning to set boundaries with my extroverted family, learning to say no, learning not to let their shaming hurt so much, and accepting that it's really okay for me to be an introvert, and not something I have to be ashamed of.  I haven't quite mastered it though, I still struggle with it sometimes.  Family's opinions can be harder to dismiss than others.

12 hours ago, Hikari said:

I've traveled to two foreign countries by myself

Ditto!  Where'd you go?

I've never really had any reticence about going out and doing things by myself when I want to do them, although I do experience loneliness and wish I had the company of a close friend from time to time.  (And of course there are safety issues.)  It's going out and doing things with other people that's hard, lol.

8 hours ago, Arcadia said:

I feel the same … that the years have had their way with me, and I am much less "strictly" an INTP than I used to be. My "T" was always close to the middle, and my I's and N's have slid that way. Still a pretty extreme P, though. And Proud of it. :smile: 

My N/S has always been close to the middle.  Where I've probably shifted the most as I've aged is with my T/F trait.  I'm distinctly T, but as I've grown in emotional intelligence and also had more experiences that have broken me personally, I've shifted a little closer to the middle on the T/F spectrum.  It's not as close as my N/S though.  Probably about as close as my J/P, but my T has given me a lot more trouble in life than my J, lol.  While I'm surrounded by Extroverts, I'm also surrounded by Feelers.  Other T's seem to be in short supply outside of this forum.

 

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people-always-think-if-you-hang-out-with

 

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On 8/28/2019 at 2:21 AM, Carol the Dabbler said:

(while making sure to have a pleasant expression on my face).

That is my problem, I don't think I look pleasant. I have been hating seeing myself in pictures since I was young, so it's not affected by time and age. I haven't even seen my own wedding pictures, it's somewhere. It would probably kill me if I had a doppelganger. Argh, the horror. 

On 8/28/2019 at 2:21 AM, Carol the Dabbler said:

So which MB type are you, VBS?

INTJ, and quite prominent as is my scale are not near the middle for all, with I and T almost at the end, like above 90%.

I do like the description of INTJ, hoping that I live up to that enough. The main reason why I like it, is because I feel like there is justification for why I feel so out of place many times. And I can blame it and use it as excuse whenever I'm called heartless or being b*tchy. It's science! (Is it science? Tell me it's science! :)

Now, I don't really care that much if people actually understand that my type exists. Personal justification is enough for me, at least that explains why I like a lot more villain characters that protags, as most of them are categorized as INTJ. Now excuse me I gotta plot something tha seems evil but you will thank me later ...

 

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18 hours ago, Hikari said:

, I routinely experience weekends during which the only human interaction I get in two days is with my barista at Starbucks.  I

Since I quitted my job, my human interaction is only with very limited service industry,  except when I go back or get visitors. It's not an exaggeration when I say I actually interact more with dogs and I actually feel much much happier! I have started to show my teeth and growl. Soon, soon! I will finally able to scratch the back of my ears with my leg.

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10 hours ago, Artemis said:

Ha, I know what you mean.  I was working in a busy urban library and hardly read anything.  Still haven't gotten back in the habit, even though I've left the library behind.

It's interesting that for you, these experiences have made you more extroverted, while for me, it's what's allowed me to become more comfortable with my introversion.  Most of my family are extroverts who don't understand introverts, and generally view introversion as a character flaw.  My mother especially was/is always criticizing and shaming me for it, and trying to force me into extroverted behavior.  It damaged my self-confidence a lot when I was growing up, and continued to into my mid-late 20's.  Part of my learning not to give a crap what other people think has involved learning to set boundaries with my extroverted family, learning to say no, learning not to let their shaming hurt so much, and accepting that it's really okay for me to be an introvert, and not something I have to be ashamed of.  I haven't quite mastered it though, I still struggle with it sometimes.  Family's opinions can be harder to dismiss than others.

Ditto!  Where'd you go?

I've never really had any reticence about going out and doing things by myself when I want to do them, although I do experience loneliness and wish I had the company of a close friend from time to time.  (And of course there are safety issues.)  It's going out and doing things with other people that's hard, lol.

My N/S has always been close to the middle.  Where I've probably shifted the most as I've aged is with my T/F trait.  I'm distinctly T, but as I've grown in emotional intelligence and also had more experiences that have broken me personally, I've shifted a little closer to the middle on the T/F spectrum.  It's not as close as my N/S though.  Probably about as close as my J/P, but my T has given me a lot more trouble in life than my J, lol.  While I'm surrounded by Extroverts, I'm also surrounded by Feelers.  Other T's seem to be in short supply outside of this forum.

 

@Artemis,

Age & experiences have helped me also be more accepting of the way I am; I used to worry about 'circulating' and making chit-chat in gatherings because I felt that it was expected.  After so many years of being forced into a 'leader' role in the classroom and in front of storytime classes and having to go on local media to promote the library and etc., I feel more at ease when I do speak, but there are times when I just don't feel like making the effort for what is a superficial return, and I stay quiet and watch people.  If there's someone I want to speak to, I do, but rather than wander around a room trying to insert myself into conversation 'just because I should', I no longer feel apologetic if I don't feel like working the room.  If anyone has anything interesting to say to me, they can find me.   As a kid, I would have framed my temperament with the negatively-connoted 'shy'.  I prefer 'reserved'.  Shy people want to speak but are crippled by fear into hobbling themselves.  'Reserved' however, is empowering--reserved people are not afraid to speak, but they 'reserve' their remarks for the most opportune moments and people.   They, not the fear, dictate when and how much they will participate.

The biggest thing I have learned through experience is that everyone is waging some sort of internal battle; even the ones that seem the most together or the life of the party have hidden pain, hidden darkness which makes them feel insecure/inferior at times.  We are all in the same boat with our human condition, but some of us, largely the introverts, have awareness of the brokenness that comes along with living in this world.  If anybody's going to mock me or judge me negatively for not being like themselves, they only demonstrate their own shallowness.   When we accept that nobody is 'better' than us and that often the prevailing cultural values that tell us that we 'have' to conform to a certain personality type to be acceptable or successful are just flat wrong and damaging . . it's freeing.  People can like me, or not . . I'm mostly just working on being OK with myself and nobody can 'give' that to me . . nor should anybody  have the power to 'take' that from me.  This knowledge has made it easier for me to be more outgoing with people, because nobody has any kind of social superpower that I don't.  The worst thing that could happen?  I get embarrassed.  That was like Kryptonite as a younger person, but it's such a routine occurrence, IJDAF anymore . . I've learned I'll live.

 You are so right that the families we grow up in create the frames of reference by which we will be known and largely know ourselves thorough life . . 'the smart one'; 'the pretty one'; 'the social butterfly'; the good/bad student', etc.  My parents were both intensely introverted, my mother more so than my dad, who had to overcome his native shyness to make a living in commission sales.  Both were not very demonstrative with praise or affection or validation, verbally or in other ways, but were generous with their criticisms.   It was not a recipe for a rock-solid foundation of self-esteem.  I was a bookworm, with an avid imaginative life, and a Romantic (big R).  My parents were both pragmatists, and never really 'got' me.  Let's just say I have a lot of empathetic understanding for Prince Charles . . we were both dreamy eldest kids of four, and out of step often with our parental units and siblings.  I remain a disappointing failure to my mother because I'm not married.  Of all us kids, I'd say only the youngest is actually Extroverted, but they've all had much more conventional paths through life than I with marriages, mortgages, kids, PTA membership, suburban lives like my parents'.   My mom remains a severe Introvert.  Comparing myself to her, I'm practically an E.  She was always telling me I was too fat and to get my face out of the book, and be more social, so even extreme Introverts can criticize other Is for not being the homecoming queen . . .interesting, isn't it?  I don't want to wind up like my mom in my old age and that propels me to pick up the phone and make plans with people.

Besides 5+ years' world of travels to and within Japan, I made a solo trip to the Far North--Yukon Territory, Canada--for 2 weeks.  If I hadn't had to get back to the sodding job, I might still be up there.  I'm not really a winter person, but I think I could live very happily in Vancouver.  Unfortunately for me, all I saw of Vancouver was the airport, but I'd love to go back properly.  I enjoy the bragging rights of being the only person I know who's been to Whitehorse, YT  . .at least until I found out that one of our security officers rode his motorcycle up there.  So there are two of us in our small-town library who've been to Whitehorse.  The British Isles are on my bucket list, along with France and some other places that get sun but hopefully  not hurricanes.

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7 hours ago, Van Buren Supernova said:

Soon, soon! I will finally able to scratch the back of my ears with my leg.

Pictures, please! 😛 

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10 hours ago, Arcadia said:

Pictures, please! 😛 

But how? By the time I achieve that, I would have forgotten how to use my thumbs.

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Train your toes!

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6 hours ago, Van Buren Supernova said:

But how? By the time I achieve that, I would have forgotten how to use my thumbs.

Train your toes! And send us pictures of your toes taking pictures, while you're at it. Inquiring minds want to know.

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Alright, alright. Training to take pictures with my toes would be handy :P, I just need to be sure that when I post it, it's not a thumbnail.

 

 

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Was it a successful double puns???

If yes, I must be on fire!!! :cowdance: :cowdance: :cowdance:

 

If not, refer to this meme

20190904-220515.jpg

 

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1 hour ago, Van Buren Supernova said:

Was it a successful double puns???

If yes, I must be on fire!!! :cowdance: :cowdance: :cowdance:

That was an utterly dreadful pun, VBS.  :P   In other words, yes, you're on fire.

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Egad, Dabbler, don't encourage her! :P 

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