Janine

[T.o.b.y]

always remember I'm kind of newbie here and I apologize if I come up with a topic that's been already talked about here for "days on end"    

 

has it been considered sherlock could be if not gay, bisexual..?   no polemics here, just a question.

 

Oh my god, yes. Poor Sherlock must be one of the most-speculated-about fictional characters when it comes to sex. People have come up with names for his supposed sexuality that I didn't even know existed (basically, you can take any word and make it end in "sexual" - I'll bet you it's been used in the context of Sherlock Holmes).

 

My personal take on this matter is that the question of his sexual orientation is largely irrelevant, because he doesn't intend to sleep with anybody any time soon. It's like, if I'm vegetarian, why should I waste any thought on whether I prefer pork or beef?

 

The only person where I have thought so far that Sherlock was physically attracted to her is Irene Adler. That proves absolutely nothing, though, except that he's attracted to Irene Adler. He sure didn't seem too fazed by Moriarty's (mock) flirting, and he wasn't insulted when John thought he was gay in A Study in Pink, or tried to correct him, so I suppose Sherlock simply doesn't care too much about gender. I wouldn't call that bisexual so much as generally disinterested - and that's not the same as asexual, because, as Irene said, he does know where to look. 

 

At the wedding, he (indirectly) called Janine "beautiful". I do think he realized that she was pretty and sexy, and I sort of doubt that Sherlock the Vain would have gotten himself an unattractive girlfriend, even if it was only a sham relationship.

 

Oh, and don't apologize for anything. Just babble ahead, like I do. I repeat myself to a criminal extent anyway, it's great if at least one person doesn't notice.

[Bendydoodle Cantaloupe]

 

My opinion only, but I think Janine is vulgar in the traditional meaning of the word -- common.  She comes out of Shelock's bedroom clearly having slept in his shirt, calling him Sherl and calling Mycroft "Myc."  I admit, I had this immediate moment of "how dare she" -- taking our rarefied characters and giving them nicknames, grabbing one of those beautiful form-fitting dress shirts and using it as nightwear, wanting our Sherlock to participate in something as plebeian as dinner with wine and sitting!  But then I really started to enjoy her for her, and I think she's a well-conceived character, whether she turns out to be a one-shot or in fact returns for S4.

 

Yes! You put it into words! That's exactly how I felt when I saw Janine walk out of Sherlock's bedroom with the Purple Shirt of Sex on -- great outrage! How could Sherlock let her do such a thing?! And I really hated the nickname 'Sherl', although 'Shezza' is alright to me.

 

(Janine called Mycroft 'Myc'? I don't remember. When was this?)

[Carol the Dabbler]

Or maybe she spells it "Mike" -- but she calls him that when she's talking with John (while Sherlock is bathing).  When John asks if she means Mycroft, she says, "Do people actually call him that?"  (My sentiments exactly!)

 

 

She could call him Snookums! Sweetiepie?

 

And you're complaining about Sherl???

 

[Arcadia]

 

Not I, said the fly...

[Arcadia]

OMG, "Sherlock the Vain." Janine should have totally called him that.

[Arcadia]

... And I really hated the nickname 'Sherl'...

It would appear you are not the only one...

 

[SherlockedCAMPer]

I love that line from Airplane and it fits perfectly with Sherlock's nickname.

[Bendydoodle Cantaloupe]

Or maybe she spells it "Mike" -- but she calls him that when she's talking with John (while Sherlock is bathing).  When John asks if she means Mycroft, she says, "Do people actually call him that?"  (My sentiments exactly!)

 

"Mycroft" is just a really weird name. Weirder than "Sherlock". But I usually just call him "Mycroft" because the pompousness of that name fits him pretty well.

 

I was talking about Sherlock once with a friend of mine and when we were discussing the part in ASiP where Mycroft asks to touch John's hand somebody yelled, "Are you talking about Minecraft? I LOVE MINECRAFT!"

[Schlauer Fuchs]

I think the problem about Janine calling Sherlock "Sherl" and Mycroft "Mike/Myc" is that they themselves would never call themselves that. From my experience, different people handle short names quite differently. There are people who would never call themselves by their full names and introduce themselves to everyone in a shorter version, then there are those who'd only want friends to use the short version but strangers/colleagues etc. the full version and then there are people who'd always want to be addressed by their full names - and that's Sherlock and Mycroft (we know that for Mycroft and I'm sure Sherlock's the same). Janine doesn't realise this and just creates a short version as is probably her habit. And that's not an evil thing to do, it's what often happens between friends let alone partners, but it still bugs me because I think she either missed or chose to ignore a part of Sherlock's identity here.

 

My general take on Janine is that she's a bit thoughtless, which I like on the one hand because it might actually do Sherlock good not to be pampered on occasion. Plus, on occasion, it's nice to encounter someone who doesn't think everything through five times but just acts out of a gut feeling. On the other hand thoughtlessness is something I dislike in general because it can easily hurt or at least annoy people. So in balance I'm okay with Janine, I neither particularly like nor dislike her. I can take and even enjoy her in small portions, I wouldn't want her to be a main dish

[Arcadia]

Good point, I've never liked it when people use a short version of my name, I feel like they're diminishing me somehow.

 

I always call people by the names given when they were introduced to me, unless they tell me otherwise. There was one acquaintance I called by her proper name for years, only to discover from a mutual friend that she preferred to be called by her short name, but was too reserved to correct me.

[T.o.b.y]

Or maybe she spells it "Mike" -- but she calls him that when she's talking with John (while Sherlock is bathing).  When John asks if she means Mycroft, she says, "Do people actually call him that?"  (My sentiments exactly!)

 

Well, his mother seems to call him "Mikey". Ugh.

 

To me, "Mycorft" sounds like someone's family name. Maybe Mycroft was simply named after some ancestor. Doesn't that happen quite often? Kids being given surnames as first names?

 

[SherlockedCAMPer]

Both happen. My son's name is a mixture of a guitarist's first & surname (it's an interesting story) only to find out the mix we used is a surname that's possibly Welsh and exists in Australia enough to not be uncommon w/o being too common.

[T.o.b.y]

 

:lol: This is a scene where I find Janine really annoying, which is strange, because she's actually being nice and happy for the married couple. But this loud whooping and clapping is exactly the kind of behavior I would never, ever exhibit myself, and that for some odd and completely unjustified reason really grates on me in real life, as well.

 

To make things even weirder, I have absolutely nothing against a good tantrum.

 

Poor Janine. Funny, pretty, smart, cool - and I don't appreciate her one bit. Not (really not) because she got a piece of Sherlock Holmes, though. Irene did that too (I'm pretty sure), and I adore her.

 

I guess Janine is as unlike myself as any fictional woman will ever be. That's probably it. (And she's not good enough for Sherlock, and not The Woman, so there. :P )

[Bakerstreet Irregular]

I think she was cheering Sherlock not Mary and John. I could be wrong but that was always my take on it. Yeah, I was kind of miffed that after she so openly flirted with him, beamed as she caught his rose then had the audacity to dance with someone else. But then, Sherlock had kind of thrown them together.

[T.o.b.y]

I think Sherlock really liked her, though. And I doubt he'd have chosen that particular plan for getting into Magnussen's office if he hadn't. It seems to work on the same level as the drugs thing -  all "for a case", but if it doesn't work out, then at least he has a good excuse for some fun.

 

I wonder whether Janine had been instructed by Magnussen to get close to Sherlock as well. Probably yes, don't you think?

[SherlockedCAMPer]

I wonder whether Janine had been instructed by Magnussen to get close to Sherlock as well. Probably yes, don't you think?

Would not surprise me at all. Anything to help him get at Mycroft that isn't obviously illegal, I could see him use.

[Arcadia]

I think Sherlock really liked her, though. And I doubt he'd have chosen that particular plan for getting into Magnussen's office if he hadn't. It seems to work on the same level as the drugs thing -  all "for a case", but if it doesn't work out, then at least he has a good excuse for some fun.

 

I wonder whether Janine had been instructed by Magnussen to get close to Sherlock as well. Probably yes, don't you think?

I can't think of any reason why Magnussen would have known about Sherlock and Janine, actually, but anything's possible. I don't think that was intended to be part of the plot, though, as in the commentary Moftiss mentioned Janine wasn't even CAM's PA until they saw the actress's performance in TSo3. Then they simply wrote her into the role. At least I think I remember that right .... (?)

 

I LOVE the way she cheers for Sherlock! Nobody else in S3 was that openly impressed with him, for one thing, it was nice to see someone appreciate his genius for a change. :P

 

I think I like Janine because she is ordinary. Doesn't hide behind a facade like Irene, or even (in a different way) like dear Molly. Doesn't put on airs like Sherlock himself, doesn't try to change herself to suit him. She just is who she is and is fine with it. I don't think she's Sherlock's intellectual equal, but then neither is John, so that's no reason to dismiss her. She's a bit carnal compared to all the other characters except Irene, and I suspect that's what bothers most people; it seems somehow out of place in this show. But she doesn't use it as a weapon the way Irene does, it's just .... what she is. Yep, I think I like her.

[Boton]

I think Sherlock really liked her, though. And I doubt he'd have chosen that particular plan for getting into Magnussen's office if he hadn't. It seems to work on the same level as the drugs thing -  all "for a case", but if it doesn't work out, then at least he has a good excuse for some fun.

 

I wonder whether Janine had been instructed by Magnussen to get close to Sherlock as well. Probably yes, don't you think?

 

I agree totally.  I think Sherlock was attracted to Janine at the wedding, and the Magnussen case gave him an excuse to hold a pretty girl in his arms without explicitly violating his own vow of abstinence, since this, of course, doesn't distract from work -- it is work.  (Right, Sherl....)  And ditto with the drugs -- the case gave him an excuse for a few guilt-free highs.  After all, the guy is only human.

 

I'm pretty sure at some point Magnussen started using Janine to gather information on Sherlock, and that at some point they were both using each other.  But that didn't mean they weren't both enjoying it.  (I'm working on a story about that very thing at the moment, so I'll have to see where my head canon leads me.)

[sittything]

Nope, still don't like her.  :P   And I'm with Toby on the over the top hollering and clapping.  Stop, just stop, Janine.  Down girl.  But I do agree that it was all for Sherlock, and not for Mary and John.  I apparently gave my heart to Molly, and she's not Molly, so I have to dislike her.  Although, Irene doesn't bother me sooo... maybe that's not it. 

 

Boton, even the suggestion that Sherlock was attracted her at the wedding make me apoplectic.  lol

 

[Boton]

Nope, still don't like her.  :P   And I'm with Toby on the over the top hollering and clapping.  Stop, just stop, Janine.  Down girl.  But I do agree that it was all for Sherlock, and not for Mary and John.  I apparently gave my heart to Molly, and she's not Molly, so I have to dislike her.  Although, Irene doesn't bother me sooo... maybe that's not it. 

 

Boton, even the suggestion that Sherlock was attracted her at the wedding make me apoplectic.  lol

 

 

Heh, then you're going to LOVE me for this statement:  Irene Adler was not the woman who beat Sherlock Holmes.  He ended SiB by cracking the passcode of her camera phone and rescuing her in Karachi.  Adler lost.  

 

Janine, on the other hand, is the woman who beat Sherlock.  She sold her story to the papers in a measured, tit-for-tat fashion, made a load of money to buy the Sussex Downs property (that she and Sherlock will eventually retire to together....   :D ), and told Sherlock that he threw away the chance to be friends because he didn't take her enough into his confidence.  She won. 

 

Janine will be back.   Bwahahahaha!

[sittything]

Can I start a petition for a "dislike" button?  ;)

[sittything]

 

Nope, still don't like her.  :P   And I'm with Toby on the over the top hollering and clapping.  Stop, just stop, Janine.  Down girl.  But I do agree that it was all for Sherlock, and not for Mary and John.  I apparently gave my heart to Molly, and she's not Molly, so I have to dislike her.  Although, Irene doesn't bother me sooo... maybe that's not it. 

 

Boton, even the suggestion that Sherlock was attracted her at the wedding make me apoplectic.  lol

 

 

Heh, then you're going to LOVE me for this statement:  Irene Adler was not the woman who beat Sherlock Holmes.  He ended SiB by cracking the passcode of her camera phone and rescuing her in Karachi.  Adler lost.  

 

Janine, on the other hand, is the woman who beat Sherlock.  She sold her story to the papers in a measured, tit-for-tat fashion, made a load of money to buy the Sussex Downs property (that she and Sherlock will eventually retire to together....   :D ), and told Sherlock that he threw away the chance to be friends because he didn't take her enough into his confidence.  She won. 

 

Janine will be back.   Bwahahahaha!

 

 

[Boton]

Anytime I can brighten your day, Sitty, just give me a yell.  :-)  

[Carol the Dabbler]

Irene Adler was not the woman who beat Sherlock Holmes.  He ended SiB by cracking the passcode of her camera phone and rescuing her in Karachi.  Adler lost.

 

Yes indeedy.  Though I will point out that it's not Conan Doyle's fault -- his Adler DID beat Holmes. Which is yet another bone I'd like to pick with Moftiss.

 

I apparently gave my heart to Molly, and she's not Molly, so I have to dislike her.

  I assume that's an oversimplification?  Otherwise, I sure hope you don't have more than one kid!  ;)

 

Can I start a petition for a "dislike" button?  ;)

 

I believe the rationale behind the "Like" button is that people can thereby express their appreciation for a post even if they have nothing in particular to add.  That hardly seems to be the case when people dislike a post!  :P

[T.o.b.y]

I think I like Janine because she is ordinary. Doesn't hide behind a facade like Irene, or even (in a different way) like dear Molly. Doesn't put on airs like Sherlock himself, doesn't try to change herself to suit him. She just is who she is and is fine with it. I don't think she's Sherlock's intellectual equal, but then neither is John, so that's no reason to dismiss her. She's a bit carnal compared to all the other characters except Irene, and I suspect that's what bothers most people; it seems somehow out of place in this show. But she doesn't use it as a weapon the way Irene does, it's just .... what she is. Yep, I think I like her.

 

And I dislike her for no good reason. She's simply the kind of woman whom I would not know what to say to in real life, and who would find me unbearably boring. Take the exact opposite of Janine and you have me, I think, apart from the large, ahem, bust.

 

But that can't really be the reason, because take the exact opposite of me and you could just as well get Irene Adler, and she - well, I think I've made my attraction to her quite clear by now. :P

 

I guess Janine feels like an intruder to me. She doesn't seem to fit into Sherlock world, she's more like the real world, and I watch Sherlock to get away from the real world, so...

 

 

Boton, even the suggestion that Sherlock was attracted her at the wedding make me apoplectic.  lol

 

Awww, I feel a bit similar, so I sympathize, but I did get the impression that yes, such was the case. It's one of those things I can't help noticing, even if I don't like them. My eyes don't always show me what I want to see, sadly enough.

 

    She sold her story to the papers in a measured, tit-for-tat fashion, made a load of money to buy the Sussex Downs property (that she and Sherlock will eventually retire to together....   :D

 

Ugh, that part of the commentary where they suggested Sherlock and Janine retiring in Sussex together nearly made me apoplectic. Until then, I had though yay, Janine buys the stupid cottage and gets rid of the bees, so that lane has been closed off and Sherlock will never go there in this version, but if he ever retires, Sherlock Holmes retires alone! That's the whole point, he becomes a hermit! Ugh-h-h-h, can you imagine Sherlock and Janine in their seventies acting like Mummy and Daddy Holmes? UGGHHHH!!!! Thank god nobody would ever pay to see that, so they'll never actually show it. I hope!

 

...

 

Just to make this perfectly clear, I think the actress does a wonderful job playing Janine, she is a very lovely woman, and the character really is hilarious, especially in His Last Vow.