Jump to content
Undead Medic

Episode 4.3 "The Final Problem"

What did you think of "The Final Problem?"  

109 members have voted

  1. 1. Add your vote here:

    • 10/10 Excellent.
    • 9/10 Not quite the best, but not far off.
    • 8/10 Certainly worth watching again.
    • 7/10 Slightly above the norm.
    • 6/10 Average.
    • 5/10 Slightly sub-par.
    • 4/10 Decidedly below average.
      0
    • 3/10 Pretty Poor.
    • 2/10 Bad.
    • 1/10 Awful.


Recommended Posts

I don't mind the retcon either, I think it works surprisingly well. 

I am not thrilled about Eurus, but then, I never wanted a third Holmes sibling in the first place. It's OK, I still love the series. 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I actually think Eurus is a rather great character, as villains go … scary dangerous and yet somehow sympathetic (she didn't make herself that way, she was born that way.) And I don't mind a 3rd sibling. It's the way her affect on Sherlock was crammed into one episode that bothers me … something that monumental (Sherlock has a huge hole in his memory and never noticed???) deserves to be better integrated into the story. But I guess we've beaten that horse to death. We need a new episode or three to eviscerate. :D 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Though personally I won't be holding my breath!

  • Sad 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Actually I would rather believe in the memory lost (actually things like that really happen), than the omnipotent, walking-through-walls-out-of-the-closed-room part. And I meant A Study in Pink talking about Jim meeting Eurus.

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Sorry, I am misunderstanding here...Jim meeting Eurus in SIP?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think she means that their 'Christmas present" meeting would have occurred at about that time 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Oh I thought the concensus was it was about SIB time...but maybe I misunderstood that, too.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hmm, "five years ago," wasn't it?  Since the show seems to operate in real time, that would be about S2,  wouldn't it.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

That's what I thought we'd all worked out, certainly on my other forum!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Wonder how they got that -- or am I mistaken about the five years?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

To me it just always makes sense:  Jim was also in touch with Irene about the Holmes boys...

Tho it's at the end of THOB we see him being released...when is it that Mycroft says 'Moriarty seems desperate to be in touch for some reason'?

Of course we SEE Xmas in ASIB, so I assume this is where it all fits in...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

OK, just checked Ariane DeVere's transcript, and when we're seeing Jim Moriarty in the Sherrinford governor's office, the titles "Christmas Day" and "Five years ago" appear on the screen.  Again, I'm assuming that the episodes take place roughly when they're aired (based mostly on Ella's comment in "Reichenbach" that it's been 18 months since John was in for a therapy session -- which was the length of time between S1 and S2).

"Final Problem" premiered in January of 2017.  We could interpret "Christmas Day five years ago" as Christmas of 2017 - 5 = 2012.  But since in January of 2017 we had very recently celebrated (or not) Christmas of 2016, we could alternatively say it's the Christmas five years before that, namely Christmas of 2011.  So Jim's visit may have occurred more or less during S2 (in 2012) or it may have occurred a year before that, between S1 and S2 (in 2011).  But in either case (unless I'm mixed up, which does happen), it seems unlikely to have occurred around the time of Study in Pink (in 2010)

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Quite so...

See I think it has to be AFTER Jim and Sherlock have had some interaction, which at least puts it post the swimming pool.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 hours ago, J.P. said:

Carol, this timeline says it was Study

order-of-events-sherlock-2.jpg?resize=67

Actually, that says Eurus got her violin on Christmas 2009.  Further down it says she meets Jim in 2010, during ASIB.

I do have to wonder about Mycroft's line (in ASIB) about Moriarty seeming desperate to get his attention. If the timeline is right, that appears to be after he arranged the meeting with Eurus. So why would Jim being trying to get his attention? Or are we to take that as a bit of dry humor on Mycroft's part … meaning that Jim has been trying to avoid Mycroft's attention? :smile: 

  • Thanks 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Well I could see how Eurus and Jim would make their plans and then turn to Mycroft to make it so...dunno, can't quite get my head round it and it all seems like ancient history now.

We know Jim was released at the end of THOB...and when he visits Sherringford at Xmas- he appears to be free, too.

Suggestion: we know Eurus has apparently being leaving Sherringford at will and operating in the real world...did she 1st meet Jim OFF Sherringford?

Tho again, unless Jim is a very good actor...the Sherringford scene we are shown appears to be his 1st meet with Eurus.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think Eurus escaping Sherrinford is supposed to be a relatively recent development. And I think we should probably move this whole discussion to the TFP thread; we just got a new member that's only seen S1 so far! Alas, I don't have time at the moment....

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I will take my next thought on this over to TFP in case anyone wants to chat more about the above.

Edited by Carol the Dabbler
This is the last of the posts moved her from the ASiP thread.
  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

It occurred to me reading the chat on other threads, that it would be really cool if Moriarty and Eurus first met as children (perhaps in a therapist's office) and began to plot Sherlock's demise together at that time. It's sort of like childhood sweethearts gone wrong.

  • Haha 4

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, bedelia1984 said:

It occurred to me reading the chat on other threads, that it would be really cool if Moriarty and Eurus first met as children (perhaps in a therapist's office) and began to plot Sherlock's demise together at that time. It's sort of like childhood sweethearts gone wrong.

That would almost be funny, in a creepy sort of way. 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Interesting, but can't really see it.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
9 hours ago, bedelia1984 said:

it would be really cool if Moriarty and Eurus first met as children

I think your definition of cool and mine are a bit different... :D 

Carol, thanks for moving the discussion, I've been in a bit of a time jam lately....

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Well, I think it would have definitely helped if the Moriarty / Eurus connection had been hinted at a bit more early on in the series. Personally, I would have preferred no Eurus at all and Moriarty to just remain Big Bad until the end, but... oh well.

  • Like 4

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I love Moriarty and can't get enough of him.

But I love Eurus, too.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think Eurus is a wonderful character and *very* nicely acted -- but I'd have preferred to see her in some other show / movie.  I think introducing her into Sherlock overbalanced the story arc even more than the introduction of Ninja Mary.

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

  • Who's Online   0 Members, 0 Anonymous, 8 Guests (See full list)

    There are no registered users currently online

×

Important Information

By using this site, you agree to our Terms of UseWe have placed cookies on your device to help make this website better. You can adjust your cookie settings, otherwise we'll assume you're okay to continue.Privacy PolicyGuidelines.