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Episode 2.1, "A Scandal In Belgravia"


Undead Medic

What did you think of "A Scandal In Belgravia?"  

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Well, look at it this way, at least it isn't the 2nd hiatus where everyone was speculating on how he survived that fall.  That apparently drove people mad.

 

Give us time.... :p

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We'll know in 18-19 months.

 

Wait..what?  :o

I thought we will get new Series in around 7 months?

Or you mean there is possibility that we won't be crazy yet by then. 

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1 new episode in 6-7 months.

 

Then a new series ... some day. I'm assuming they are waiting until we've all been put in straightjackets before they announce the air date.

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Per Gatiss, we may or may not all still be alive by the time series 4 airs, depending on how long we live.  lol

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1 new episode in 6-7 months.

 

Then a new series ... some day. I'm assuming they are waiting until we've all been put in straightjackets before they announce the air date.

 

 

Per Gatiss, we may or may not all still be alive by the time series 4 airs, depending on how long we live.  lol

 

 

:facepalm:  :blanket: Didn't know about this. I thought the special will be followed up shortly with Series 4.

 

 

tumblr_m92gqnfxaH1r0ohso.gif

 

Move over Moriarty, I will need that corner and straight jacket.

 

(hey, on the plus side, I'm motivated enough to learn how to attach gif)

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No, S4 doesn't even begin filming until spring of 2016.  It is generally assumed (but by no means confirmed) that S4 will not air until Christmas 2016/New Years 2017.

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That seems to be the likely scenario, yes.  On the bright side, that means we're apparently getting new Sherlocks two years in a row!  First time that's ever happened.

 

Looking around, it would seem that Tim (Undead Medic) and I are the oldest active "hiatus survivors" here, having joined in February and April, respectively, of 2012.  Other than a few members who check in only now and then (though we'd love to see them more often), the next oldest active members are Fox (Bakerstreet Irregular) and Bev (besleybean) from December 2012, and Martina (Caya) from April of 2013, which takes us up to mid-2013, six months before Series 3.

 

Feel free to judge our sanity for yourselves!

 

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Feel free to judge our sanity for yourselves!

You're on here helping to hyper discuss Sherlock. I think sanity left all of us almost at the moment of arrival here. That's my story and I'm sticking to it. :)

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True, I think my sanity got on the plane with Sherlock and isn't coming back until he does. It will be nice to see it again, though the time be brief .....

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I really need to breathe into a bag... 

why, why did I ask??

 

Maybe by that time the only thing left to talk about is type of tobacco ash, and I guess many of us don't smoke.

 

So, frustation got me into wasting time to do this,

Sherlock has very pale complexion and the lighting in the series is almost always cool lighting, so it's a bit of a mess.

This is consider bringing us back to the topic, it's in SIB episode  :P

r2rel5.jpg

In case you guys forget who it is, there is a source picture on the right.

And I also include a quote from Jack Sparrow that maybeeeeee Sherlock can get into as well.

 

 

 

Obsession: sneak in to make and post this. Work is indeed boring.

 

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Still don't quite get the jealousy angle, I'm afraid. I agree he was showing off, and I'm guessing he's cynical about "the Christmas spirit" in general .... and yeah, it sounds right to me that he was trying, on some level, to spoil everyone else's fun because it was all for them, it wasn't about HIM. (Ironic, then, that the one person who was very much there for him is the person he poured the most vitriol on.)

 

I guess one thing I'm trying to fathom ... why insert this scene into this particular story? Maybe I'm trying to make connections where there aren't any? I mean, normally I would assume anything that happens in a story has some bearing on it, but in a serialzed tale, that's not always the case, is it? Sometimes things will happen in one episode that have no relevance until 3 episodes later.

 

But if the Christmas scene IS meant to illustrate something within the larger context of Sherlock's encounter with Irene, I'm at a bit of a loss to figure out what it is. Hmmmm...

 

Good question, Arcadia! What an interesting point to consider.

 

I'd simply thought it was an easy way to show the passing of time (insert winter holiday to signify that a few months have passed....) 

 

I mean, it didn't have to be Christmas for Irene to leave a gift-wrapped phone on the mantel.

 

It does serve as an interesting contrast with His Last Vow -- Christmas "drinkies" at 221B Baker Street vs. Christmas at Sherlock's parents' house. 

 

But this is worth mulling over...

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Time for some mulled wine! (Ah har har har....)

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The Christmas scene is primarily a tool to get Sherlock to the phone on the mantle.  Everything else about it is primarily window dressing for that one plot contrivance.  But of course, the wonderful bit with Molly where he gets a bit of comeuppance and apologizes is lovely.

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So I am in the clinic, the surgery is set for tomorrow morning at 7 (which is middle of the night in my eyes). I watched the half of ASIB successfully distracting myself from the prospect. Don't think I will be able to write anything tomorrow (will probably be babbling like Sherlock after Irene's drug shot) Some thoughts I collected while watching:

I still wonder what made Jim's so mad at the pool. What did Irene say? (BTW, I seem to have some problems with interpreting the pool scene: first I didn't get the meaning of Sherlock aiming his gun at the explosives and the glance he gets from John, then I somehow missed that the call JIm got was from Irene) Jim is very creative in inventing threats, isn't he.

 

Loved the remark about John writing a lot. Of course it MUST have been about Sherlock if it's a lot. But I suppose the impression might come from the fact that John is writing so slowly.
And Sherlock is still jealous because nobody wants to read about tobacco ash. :D

The boomerang is actually visible at the total shot of the dead hiker. (upper left corner)

The black fur Irene has in her hand while going into her house - do you think Mary inherited it? :D

As the car guy comes to 221B Mrs Hudson yells at the "boys", as if they were upstairs. Johnlockers rejoice! :P

Wonder what causes the burning animosity Sherlock is displaying while the palace sequence. He's behaving like a 5 years old. The look he gives the guys who came to 221B and then Harry... He seems to be totally p****d  about about Mycroft's action. The nice John-Sherlock bonding interlude with pants, ashtray and visiting queen: I like Sherlock's baritone laugh. We don't hear him laughing much, do we?

Nice parallel between Irene watching Sherlock in sheet and Sherlock watching her photos.

Mycroft's "how'd you know" remark really hit Sherlock. Bad, bad Myc.
But John visibly enjoys himself in that situation.

Another parallels between Sherlock and Irene going to battle. (Sherlock repeats the words as he gets prepared for the wedding in TSOT)

Hilarious fight scene - John punches Sherlock with his right hand! He really has issues with his temper - he's so easy to provoke! :)

Now - Sherlock reaction to Irene's big entry. It doesn't have to be anyway connected with him being alarmed by sex. I probably would react exactly the same way if a woman greeted me in her Eve's costume.

The expressions of John's and Sherlock's faces! Gosh I could watch them in the loop for hours.

Sherlock's strong emotional reaction as John has been threaten by one of the agents.

Irene also uses drugs on her friends. :D

A factual error: I have read somewhere that boomerangs sold to tourists don't come back - surely for safety reasons. :P

Sherlock's vision of Irene solving the case - of course it's not her, but his inner picture of her - quite flattering if you ask me, but then, she is very impressed by him being so quick. Which is basically Sherlock making compliments to himself.

Another funny parallel - Irene talking to drugged sleeping Sherlock and Lestrade filming him in this state. Just like in HLV!

Wonder if the paper title about a refit for Bart's isn't a real one. There is a real refit going on, maybe it was announced as they filmed? They wanted to include the scaffolding into the fall initially.

Xmas scene. We've been discussing it long enough, but I finally got that the boring teacher Sherlock's talking about, is actually Jeanette!

I'd love to know what happened to Sara.

The longer I watch, the stronger the feeling that the not-mourning-Sherlock-interpretation might be right. Mycroft is after her, so through her action Irene (successfully) tries to convince him she's dead. And she's using Sherlock as a willing confident.
There is absolutely no reaction Sherlock shows seeing the body. What a difference to his reaction to the old woman's death. He might really not care for her at all, or he knows she's alive. It's others that constantly see him as grieving, even Mycroft.

The only moment I cannot decide what to think about is at the power station, when Irene says John not to come after Sherlock.

Why do the makers invented an airline? Was this whole Coventry allusion too touchy?

 

That's all folks, I hope I see you soon.

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I don't know if you'll get to see this before the surgery, but here's wishing you all the best. Hope to see you back real soon.
 

Now - Sherlock reaction to Irene's big entry. It doesn't have to be anyway connected with him being alarmed by sex. I probably would react exactly the same way if a woman greeted me in her Eve's costume.

Same here!
 

A factual error: I have read somewhere that boomerangs sold to tourists don't come back - surely for safety reasons. :P

But the guy was an "expert sportsman" or something like that, so maybe he had ways of getting ahold of the real deal?
 

The only moment I cannot decide what to think about is at the power station, when Irene says John not to come after Sherlock.

Could be her ego talking; even Irene thinks he's been grieving for her! :smile: Yeah, that line still puzzles me too. As I guess it is meant to.

 

Why do the makers invented an airline? Was this whole Coventry allusion too touchy?

I don't know the particulars, but I seem to remember that, for legal reasons, TV shows aren't supposed to use the names of real products/real businesses. Like it's an endorsement, or something.

 

That's all folks, I hope I see you soon.

Same here, be well!

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Speedy recovery, JP!

 

Carrying forward what you (I think) said in the thread for TGG, when we were discussing how many times Sherlock dropped that CIA agent out the window, I've settled on agreement with you.  Sherlock delivered an epic beat-down, and then he dropped the guy out the window for good measure for Lestrade to find.  Lestrade was just getting the story straight so his paperwork lined up OK, and the "official" story is now that an armed intruder clumsily fell out the window of 221B repeatedly, leaving Sherlock officially innocent. 

 

I like to imagine Lestrade kicked him (the agent) a couple of times for good measure, because no one lets anyone threaten Mrs. Hudson!

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Thanks, guys.
 
Just finished watching.
 
Okay, I made a wrong deduction before: The morgue scene happens on the Christmas Eve and not later. Jeanette is still at 221B as Mycroft calls John about the danger night. Danger Night - would like to know what's behind it.

One of the most annoying bad behavior moments - Holmes boys tend to throw their cig butts and ashes just on the floor. Aaargh! And what still puts me off - it's Sherlock closing the bedroom's door just before John's face. Reminds me of his moment with Anderson. I can understand or explain why he was so nasty to Molly just a moment before, but that - that's a "I want to punch you in the face" moment, and I wouldn't even mind cutting my hand at one of those cheekbones. punish2.gif

John trying to talk about emotions to composing Sherlock. But I wonder why Sherlock thinks that by the blog faulty Irene sends him a message with the code to her phone?

Have you notice how John is taxing the woman sent by Irene? I wonder if it is only because he tries to find out what's so different about Anthea :P

John: Sherlock doesn't follow me everywhere - yeah, sure!

Does 1058 has a meaning?

And now to the 007 allocation. Sherlock's deduction is brilliant, but does it make sense? It is a row of seat numbers. What for? I assume that you need a second half of the table to make it work, like names of the passengers... I can imagine that even if they actually didn't need boarding plan for dead people, they wanted to make the plan look real. But if yes, then how can you replace a jumbo without nobody noticing. If they were to fake the flight, there must have been the usual procedure of selling tickets, boarding... and then what? Hire David Copperfield to make one plane disappear and other pop out of...     

Oooh. (said in the best Sherlock manner)

One plane starts with living people, the other starts elsewhere; they change places in the clouds. Well, I never took time to think about the procedure before. :) But still, the allocation order alone makes no sense, beside to let Sherlock find out the particular aircraft and flight. :wtf:
Plus they needed the whole plane of living people who would know about the trick, at least after their aircraft landed in the middle of nowhere.... And now it's even more ridiculous. If they had a plane full of living people, they must have put them all in a witness protection program. Because they are officially dead, even if  someone replaced their bodies.... Another Plothole/Fan pitfall? Or is it my brain that doesn't work yet?

What I love about this episode though, is the ambiguity on so many levels. You never know what's in those two funny heads of Irene and Sherlock. Or in Mycroft's head when he tells John about Irene's fate.

I wonder if Sherlock ever told John about Bond Air. I doubt he did.

PS; "Because I took your pulse" scene. Holly Molly! His voice surely made her pregnant. With twins.

 

PS2: there are two fantastic moments of Mycroft showing his emotions: after he receives the text from Jim, and when he yells at Sherlock in the plane. He also has a dragon face, and it's quite intimidating.

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So, I have a lot of questions... 

 

John's blog - Are all of those smaller mentioned cases from canon or made up for the purpose of the show?  My concern is if they're from canon, how much material did they just burn through right there?  I haven't really looked at John's blog online, nor have I gotten through The Sign of Four yet, so I have no clue on this.

 

I always assumed that Sherlock's involvement with Irene Adler came about from nothing more than Mycroft having him try to get the photos.  But I caught a line of Irene Adler's this time that made me think:  "Hello.  I think it's time, don't you?"   Are we to assume that she's speaking to Moriarty there?  Was Irene contacting the palace about the photos all just to get Sherlock to her?  All part of Moriarty's plan?  

 

Mycroft says that Irene is known as "The Woman."  Is this consistent with canon, or was "the woman" just Sherlock's name for her in canon?

 

 

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I always assumed that Sherlock's involvement with Irene Adler came about from nothing more than Mycroft having him try to get the photos.  But I caught a line of Irene Adler's this time that made me think:  "Hello.  I think it's time, don't you?"   Are we to assume that she's speaking to Moriarty there?  Was Irene contacting the palace about the photos all just to get Sherlock to her?  All part of Moriarty's plan?

 

Exactly my thought, and I wasn't paying attention to that part either. But what exactly was Jim's plan? Was it that "code" he wanted to have cracked - and the female anonymous person was only a bite? Then Irene's game with letting Sherlock get the phone, take it back, and then send it to him - was it all staged? If it was, does the interpretation, in which Irene sends the text on Christmas to let Sherlock know she's alive - does it still make sense?

 

And you know what? What was the evidence she had anything important stored on that phone, beside the photos she sent to the palace and the seat allocation? What if the phone were a small version of Appledore? I mean, it obviously ended well, but how the Holmes brothers knew she's not bluffing?

 

Do Mofftiss have a backstory for this whole plot?!? :wacko:

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I think there were two power plays going on in this - one with Irene and her photos and the other with Moriarty using Irene's phone info to trump and demolish the "flight of the dead" scheme Mycroft had been planning, and Sherlock was just the pawn to accomplish both things.  Of course, Irene was a pawn for Moriarty as well, because he needed that information decoded so that he could turn it on Mycroft.

 

And at some point after that episode, Moriarty was brought in questioned... in a not so nice way, as we find out in TEH, but we see him in his cell at the end of THOB.  Then of course, he's on trial in TRF... what exactly was he on trial for?  Conspiracy of some sort?

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So, I have a lot of questions...

 

John's blog - Are all of those smaller mentioned cases from canon or made up for the purpose of the show? My concern is if they're from canon, how much material did they just burn through right there? I haven't really looked at John's blog online, nor have I gotten through The Sign of Four yet, so I have no clue on this.

 

I always assumed that Sherlock's involvement with Irene Adler came about from nothing more than Mycroft having him try to get the photos. But I caught a line of Irene Adler's this time that made me think: "Hello. I think it's time, don't you?" Are we to assume that she's speaking to Moriarty there? Was Irene contacting the palace about the photos all just to get Sherlock to her? All part of Moriarty's plan?

 

Mycroft says that Irene is known as "The Woman." Is this consistent with canon, or was "the woman" just Sherlock's name for her in canon?

Some of the stories on John's blog are based on titles of ACD short stories: The Speckled Blond = The Speckled Band, The Navel Treatment = The Naval Treaty. It's still possible to use those story lines in future episodes even if the title doesn't get used again.

 

The title of The Woman is from canon. It's Sherlock's reference to her in Bohemia so was correctly pulled for Belgravia.

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Oh, no... I know Sherlock referred to her as "The Woman" in canon, but in ASIB it's a name Mycroft says she's known by before Sherlock uses it to refer to her.  So not something that Sherlock came up with.

 

MYCROFT: Irene Adler, professionally known as The Woman. (from Ariane DeVere)

 

In canon was that a name that Sherlock came up with, or was she already known by "The Woman" prior to Sherlock meeting her in canon?

 

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So I am in the clinic, the surgery is set for tomorrow morning at 7 (which is middle of the night in my eyes).

 

Mycroft's "how'd you know" remark really hit Sherlock. Bad, bad Myc.

But John visibly enjoys himself in that situation.

 

Wonder if the paper title about a refit for Bart's isn't a real one. There is a real refit going on, maybe it was announced as they filmed? They wanted to include the scaffolding into the fall initially.

 

Hi, J.P.  If I'm calculating the time zones correctly, you've already posted since your surgery, so I take it that things went just fine.  Best wishes for a speedy convalescence!

 

You don't have to continue feeling sorry for Sherlock regarding Mycroft's "How would you know?" gibe -- Sherlock got even with him using the identical line in "Empty Hearse," when Mycroft said he wasn't lonely.

 

No, I don't think they were actually working on Bart's at that time.  They were thinking of using the scaffolding as part of Sherlock's fake fall, but changed their minds.  Or something like that.  But the commentary is ambiguous, so your conjecture may well be correct.  (Extensive work is currently planned or underway at Bart's now, though.  Sounds like the exterior may become virtually unrecognizable.)

 

I ... seem to remember that, for legal reasons, TV shows aren't supposed to use the names of real products/real businesses. Like it's an endorsement, or something.

 

Unless the business is paying them for the publicity!  Then it's called "product placement."  (Though those laws may be different in the U.K.)

 

Oh, no... I know Sherlock referred to her as "The Woman" in canon, but in ASIB it's a name Mycroft says she's known by before Sherlock uses it to refer to her.  So not something that Sherlock came up with.

 

MYCROFT: Irene Adler, professionally known as The Woman. (from Ariane DeVere)

 

In canon was that a name that Sherlock came up with....?

I think that's what Watson means for us to think, at least. He never mentions her being publicly known (during her opera career, for example) by that name. He just says that's how Holmes refers to her, as though that was unusual.

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