Getting into 221B without a key

[IQ192]

LoL @ this thread and the locks thing......good point!

At other times people ring the bell , coming with cases , so hmmm

Sometimes / Usually on those big old wooden doors with a knob you have to actually turn the key ( imagine the traditional iron type of key) in the lock for the door to actually lock . Most people have added a Yale type lock to these old doors by now but I haven't noticed one in the show  and googley images aren't conclusive the one IRL is diff
 ...so maybe people just have to turn the knob and push ....sometimes its locked , others times ~ whoops they forgot .

[Julia Mae]

LoL @ this thread and the locks thing......good point!

 

At other times people ring the bell , coming with cases , so hmmm

 

Sometimes / Usually on those big old wooden doors with a knob you have to actually turn the key ( imagine the traditional iron type of key) in the lock for the door to actually lock . Most people have added a Yale type lock to these old doors by now but I haven't noticed one in the show  and googley images aren't conclusive the one IRL is diff

 ...so maybe people just have to turn the knob and push ....sometimes its locked , others times ~ whoops they forgot .

 

There is no knob on the outside door.   You don't have to rely on Google, BTW, the series is available online at Netflix.  There's no knob.

 

Besides, Carol has been there and seen the door.

 

(edited to add: What I said above turns out to be pretty much wrong.  Look below.)

 

[Carol the Dabbler]

There is no knob on the outside door.   You don't have to rely on Google, BTW, the series is available online at Netflix.  There's no knob.

 

Besides, Carol has been there and seen the door.

 

True.  There's no knob visible on television, there's no knob in real life, and I actually stood just a few feet away and watched them trick things up for a Series 3 shoot (see my North Gower thread for details), and they did not add any knob.  There's just a deadbolt-type keyhole on the outside.

 

[Julia Mae]

Well, shoot. 

 

There does seem to be a knob.

 

I started thinking about John and Sherlock in the hallway just as they leave for the courthouse in TRF.  John definitely reaches for some sort of handle and pulls the door open.   It opens in, so there must be something.  Now, it could have a handle without a lock mechanism, which would mean no outside knob.  AND, that interior hallways is a set, it's not at the Gower Street location.

 

So, I went to S1E1 and got a very brief glimpse of the door the first time we see it, just as Mrs. Hudson goes in behind Sherlock and John.  It was WAY dark, and this is a lightened version, very grainy, but - there's a knob on the outside of the door, down at the same level as the mailslot:

 

 

 

I'm not sure what this means for the discussion, exactly, but there is a knob.

[Carol the Dabbler]

A lot of deadbolt locks have a little thing on the inside that you can turn to open the lock by hand, so you can get out without a key.  The one on the inside of the 221 front door is shown very clearly in "Reichenbach," turning as Moriarty unlocks the door from the outside.

 

As for that thing on the outside, I don't offhand recall seeing it, so I'm not sure what it is.  I'll try to remember to have a look at my photos tomorrow (too sleepy tonight!) and see if I can tell.  It seems odd that there would be a functional knob down that low, though (unless maybe that's the hobbit entrance?).

 

[IQ192]

Wellllll lol i just...  idk there is a yale lock ,,,we see it when the american alphabet guys have broken in as u say so doh@me  hmmmm
and idk bout the knob for sure , but those door types usually have one about just above the knee height and yes i rem them turning it going out on screen so i kinda assumed at the front too but idk.
I guess we just get to blame Sherlock for never bothering to lock it and going out all hours and leaving it open etc or Mrs Hudson being in Speedy's doing scratch cards.... but deffo a lol to watch out for next time.

I saw some of Carols pics ~ looked mad but fun. and lol @ the hobbit entrance.

The 221b  door changes all the time over the past decades....its been high glossed , polished , plasticised , painted , had lamps above it ,,,, gas lights beside it  @ at one point tree thingies , olympic thingies and a chinese dragon etc etc etc. So idk its confusing me as to whats on screen. Tho they actually film this vers. in Gower St.
I do like the battered / shabby look the bbc have given the door this time tho, it suits the show.
 

[Julia Mae]

A lot of deadbolt locks have a little thing on the inside that you can turn to open the lock by hand, so you can get out without a key.  The one on the inside of the 221 front door is shown very clearly in "Reichenbach," turning as Moriarty unlocks the door from the outside.

 

Yes!  B ut when John reaches to open the door for Sherlock in TRF, he doesn't reach for the deadbolt latch, but down further, where we can't see, but where a knob would be - where this one looks like it is.  I'll be so interested to see what your pictures show.

 

[SH/LotR/Zelda Fan]

/>(unless maybe that's the hobbit entrance?).

LOL!!! Er...well...I actually think hobbits are be smaller than that...it would ACTUALLY be a tall hobbit who could reach that...hmmm...

[Carol the Dabbler]

Actually, that little knob looks just about the right height for a hobbit -- roughly 30" above the top step -- about chest-high on a 3'6" hobbit.

 

But I believe I've answered the "what is it?" question, with this photo of the real-life door from July of 2011.

 

 

See all the differences?  This year, near as I recall, the real-life door was exactly like the 221B door except for the house number.  But back then, there was no knocker, there was a plainer letterbox, and instead of the little knee-high knob, there's a handle next to the keyhole.  So I'm reasonably certain that the little knob is simply something to grab hold of in order to pull the door closed, with no connection to any sort of lock or latch mechanism.

 

[Julia Mae]

Actually, that little knob looks just about the right height for a hobbit -- roughly 30" above the top step -- about chest-high on a 3'6" hobbit.

 

But I believe I've answered the "what is it?" question, with this photo of the real-life door from July of 2011.

 

 

See all the differences?  This year, near as I recall, the real-life door was exactly like the 221B door except for the house number.  But back then, there was no knocker, there was a plainer letterbox, and instead of the little knee-high knob, there's a handle next to the keyhole.  So I'm reasonably certain that the little knob is simply something to grab hold of in order to pull the door closed, with no connection to any sort of lock or latch mechanism.

 

Carol, that's a new door.  I wonder if the show bought them one since they kept  messing with it.   Here's a shot from SIP:

 

 

.

 

 

[Carol the Dabbler]

Good point, the millwork is different, so that's one more new thing, the door itself.  Now that you mention it, I do seem to recall reading that the production people had gotten tired of swapping out the door, so they finally just made a present of it.

 

However, that does not change my basic contention, that the little knob on the new door is a "knob" in exactly the same sense as the little round jobbie on a cabinet door -- it's merely a convenient thing to grab hold of while opening / closing the door -- no lock or latch involved.

 

Next time I'm going there, remind me to have a closer look!

 

[Julia Mae]

Good point, the millwork is different, so that's one more new thing, the door itself.  Now that you mention it, I do seem to recall reading that the production people had gotten tired of swapping out the door, so they finally just made a present of it.

 

However, that does not change my basic contention, that the little knob on the new door is a "knob" in exactly the same sense as the little round jobbie on a cabinet door -- it's merely a convenient thing to grab hold of while opening / closing the door -- no lock or latch involved.

 

Oh,  I completely agree.  After all, that's what we see on the new door: a pull handle.  Or a "push/pull handle" I suppose.  So, I wonder do they film the new door or swap it out with the old door for S3?  What did your pictures show?

 

(This fandom is getting really weird after all this time, isn't it?)

 

[Carol the Dabbler]

Just to get our terminology straight -- the "old door" (the one with the D-shaped handle by the keyhole) is the former real-life door at 187 North Gower.  Judging by the SiP frame that you posted, it was never used for Sherlock (with the possible exception of the pilot?) -- they've always used the "new door" (the one with the knocker) for filming.  Our real-life photo of 187 North Gower from 2011 (see this post) was actually taken during the filming of Series 2 (though not while they were filming on North Gower), but it shows the "old door" in place -- so it would seem that they used to swap doors just for filming.

 

However, the first time we went to North Gower this year, the door appeared to be just as you see it on TV (except for the house number), even though they weren't going to be filming for another ten days yet.  Here it is on the morning of May 11th:

 

 

So I assume they just leave the "new door" there all the time now.

 

Added:  What do you mean, getting weird?

 

[Julia Mae]

Just to get our terminology straight -- the "old door" (the one with the D-shaped handle by the keyhole) is the former real-life door at 187 North Gower.  Judging by the SiP frame that you posted, it was never used for Sherlock (with the possible exception of the pilot?) -- they've always used the "new door" (the one with the knocker) for filming.  Our real-life photo of 187 North Gower from 2011 (see this post) was actually taken during the filming of Series 2 (though not while they were filming on North Gower), but it shows the "old door" in place -- so it would seem that they used to swap doors just for filming.

 

However, the first time we went to North Gower this year, the door appeared to be just as you see it on TV (except for the house number), even though they weren't going to be filming for another ten days yet.  Here it is on the morning of May 11th:

 

 

So I assume they just leave the "new door" there all the time now.

 

Added:  What do you mean, getting weird?

 

Okay, now.  Bear with me because I am easily confused. 

 

 

 

Above is a picture of what I am going to call the "cross door" because of the pattern, from ASIB.  This is when he goes home and finds the CIA guys.  So, this is the same door from ASIP.  The door in your pictures without the cross pattern, I'm calling the "plain door."   Okay, so that's the two doors.  Then we have your pictures which can be during filming or non-filming and we have screencaps.

 

So, now - could you explain it to me again?

 

(I'm sorry.  When I work things out for myself, I often make diagrams.)

 

 

[Carol the Dabbler]

OK, what I was calling the "old door" is what you call the "plain door" (much more self-explanatory!), and what I called the "new door" is what you call the "cross door" (ditto).  I'll use your terminology in the following series of -- umm -- deductions:

 

The plain door was apparently there in real life before Sherlock was even a twinkle in Moftiss's eye.  When they chose that house for "221B," they wanted a more distinctive door -- so whenever they were setting up to film on North Gower, they would remove the plain door and put the cross door in its place (it's even in the pilot, we just checked).  Then when they were done filming, they would swap the plain door back into place.  That's why our 2011 photo of 187 North Gower shows the plain door, because they weren't filming there that day.

 

At some point between Series 2 and Series 3, they decided it was too much of a hassle to keep swapping doors, so they just left the cross door permanently in place.  Now all they have to swap is the house number.  That's why our non-filming-day photo from this year shows the cross door with the number 187.

 

Any better?

 

[Julia Mae]

OK, what I was calling the "old door" is what you call the "plain door" (much more self-explanatory!), and what I called the "new door" is what you call the "cross door" (ditto).  I'll use your terminology in the following series of -- umm -- deductions:

 

The plain door was apparently there in real life before Sherlock was even a twinkle in Moftiss's eye.  When they chose that house for "221B," they wanted a more distinctive door -- so whenever they were setting up to film on North Gower, they would remove the plain door and put the cross door in its place (it's even in the pilot, we just checked).  Then when they were done filming, they would swap the plain door back into place.  That's why our 2011 photo of 187 North Gower shows the plain door, because they weren't filming there that day.

 

At some point between Series 2 and Series 3, they decided it was too much of a hassle to keep swapping doors, so they just left the cross door permanently in place.  Now all they have to swap is the house number.  That's why our non-filming-day photo from this year shows the cross door with the number 187.

 

Any better?

 

Thank you!  Yes, now I get it.  Okay, I have one more question.  When you were there, was it before they  started filming S3E1?  I'm wondering if, because they film there intermittently during the time they shoot three episodes, they might have put the cross door in place and just left it, only changing the numbers in-between?  Or - wait - did you say you'd heard or read that they gave them the door? 

 

[Carol the Dabbler]

I believe I read that somewhere a while back, yes -- though I didn't fully understand it until you pointed out that our 2011 photo clearly shows a different door!

 

We were there this year during the latter stages of filming for Episode 2, and they had already done some extensive filming on North Gower for Episode 1 (judging by the photos on the internet), so yes, our first visit was between episodes as it were.  But I don't think that has much to do with it.  Our 2011 visit was also during filming (though none of it was being done on North Gower while we were in town).  So I don't think they leave anything set up between episodes.  Judging by our experience this year, they don't start setting up until the day before filming.

 

Anyway, that's my best guess.  If anyone on the forum happens to be there when they're setting up for Episode 3 filming, please ask one of the nice crew people!

 

[Carol the Dabbler]

OK, I finally had a look for that info, and of course it's on Sherlockology!

 

 

 

Following completion of filming on Series two, the 221B door is now a permanent fixture outside, complete with the distinctive door knocker and letterbox.

 

 

[Julia Mae]

Ah!  Excellent.   I like this, it'll be great for local tourism, along with Speedy's, of course.   It doesn't give us a satisfying answer to the question, but it does give me a sense of "all's right with the world."

[Carol the Dabbler]

And you can sleep at night!

 

[Julia Mae]

And you can sleep at night!

 

Yes, finally!  (Or at least I will when the heat breaks.)

 

So, I'm watching a bit of ASIB last night and Sherlock and John walk out the door which John pulls shut behind him.  Using the knocker.

 

But, entering the door when the note is a on it, you can still see a round bit of metal something at letter-slot level, which is shown fuzzily in my picture someplace above.

 

If it's a doorknob, why wouldn't he use that?  Reaching up for the knocker is awkward.   So we may need to be reinstating your original observation: no knob on that door.  At all.

 

[Carol the Dabbler]

That sounds like it could be hard on the knocker in the long run.  Maybe John closes the door that way because the little round jobbie is a bit hard to get hold of (especially when you're trying to look like, "hey, I do this all the time").

 

But there's something there, because it shows up in Alex's photos too.  Maybe not a knob, though.  Will definitely need to have a closer look next time.

 

Is this what they mean by "minutiae"?

 

[Julia Mae]

 

Is this what they mean by "minutiae"?

 

Yes.  This is why other fandoms feel sorry for the Sherlocked.  We are desperately trolling for topics at this point.

 

 

 

I actually have a topic for Reichenbach, but have to get some work done, first.  Procrastination is my greatest writing skill.    To that end, (a new topic, not procrastination) do you have an address where the rooftop scenes of Sherlock talking to John before he jumps were actually shot?  I want to get a Google map overhead of the roof.  

 

[Bakerstreet Irregular]

It shows quite clearly the splintered wood on the doorjamb where the latch would have been holding.

[Carol the Dabbler]

Is the wood splintered in only one area, and is that next to the keyhole?

 

The roof that John was looking up at is on West Smithfield, which is only about a block long.  Just look for the little freestanding ambulance building opposite.  (I'm still pondering the real-life identity of the roof where Sherlock and Jim were.  A while back I saw a web site where someone claimed to have identified it, and you might be able to find that with Google.)

 

Added:  See following post.