Episode 2.3, "The Reichenbach Fall"

[Carol the Dabbler]

Awww, baby picture!  

 

[Bakerstreet Irregular]

Wow...even as an infant he has the hint of those amazing eyes!

[Julia Mae]

Now all we have to do is figure out a segue to the actual thread topic.

[Carol the Dabbler]

Wha ... ?  Uh -- oh, yeah -- clues!

 

[Julia Mae]

There is an article here about what was said by Mofftiss at ComicCon that was posted on tmblr as a series of screenshots.

 

I'm going to repost some of it here so we can discuss it.

 

 

 

Note that it doesn't say "based on footage in the episode."  But in "season two."   It's always seemed to me, we need to start with John and Mycroft meeting outside Speedy's to find the true beginning of TRF.  In any case, maybe we need to re-examine the whole of Series 2 for clues.

 

 

So this, at least, as any part of the answer to "what happened" eliminates the "Jim's alive" portion of theories.

 

 

 

Sometimes people bolster arguments based on the "Sherlock's a sociopath" version of Holmesian reality.  He is not, and I'm thrilled they finally stated that in clear terms.

 

There are more of these at the link, but these relate to TRF.  (Also, this is not what I was going to post about with the roof view, but I think it relates because to get to that you have to go back.  Not being disingenuous, just thought this info should be in our framework for ideas first.)

 

 

[Carol the Dabbler]

Thanks for posting that link.  Two side comments off the top of my head:

 

1.  Not so sure this person got #6 quite straight: "Series 4 has been commissioned."  My impression from Sherlockology is that Cumberbatch and Freeman have been optioned, which is clearly a step in the right direction, but hardly the same thing.  Has anyone posted a video or audio clip of the panel (or that portion of it)?

 

2,  I'm glad that Moftiss appear to have been paying attention to the show.  (Yes, I'm being a bit tongue in cheek -- but I always had the impression that Gene Roddenberry never quite "got" Star Trek.)

 

[Julia Mae]

Thanks for posting that link.  Two side comments off the top of my head:

 

1.  Not so sure this person got #6 quite straight: "Series 4 has been commissioned."  My impression from Sherlockology is that Cumberbatch and Freeman have been optioned, which is clearly a step in the right direction, but hardly the same thing.  Has anyone posted a video or audio clip of the panel (or that portion of it)?

 

 

 

They might be a bit behind, tumblr people often get the goods within minutes.  Your question is the first one I asked.  So, there were actually two panels at Comic Con.  One, I don't have a link for a video to, probably because they showed an exclusive clip that was not to be distributed.  The second, done right afterward, is a panel for a non-profit cause.  There is video of that I have on my YouTube channel:

 

It starts about 8:06 and goes for an hour, I have not watched the whole thing.  What I know is: Mark Gatiss is just the dearest man ever. 

 

But I think someone has some kind of film of the first because there are gifs from it.  Moffat's comment here about Moriarty being dead is much pithier than his reported comment from the main panel.  Maybe I'll have time to watch it all tomorrow, or you will get to the library.  ( Did you get headphones and.. how can the library have decent local internet, but you can't get it at home? I want you to have great internet!) 

 

[Carol the Dabbler]

I bought a pair of headphones, but haven't tried them yet.  That video may be just the incentive I need to get back to the library -- no way I could watch it at home.  Thanks!

 

We're out in the country.  There is DSL available here, as well as satellite internet service, and a sort of local wi-fi that uses a network of towers.  We're considering the DSL (though it's probably too slow for streaming video, at least downloads would be about 10X faster), but the satellite service is reputed to be unreliable, and the other service is new enough that we haven't really checked it out.  The library is in a town a 15-minute drive away.  I've never asked what sort of service they're hooked up to.

 

[Julia Mae]

  The library is in a town a 15-minute drive away.  I've never asked what sort of service they're hooked up to.

 

If they have DSL, you can see how well they stream.

 

Streaming for me had everything to do with how much RAM I have and not much to do with my DSL.  I have the cheapest, lowest speed you can get and I get everything just fine.  But I also have 8 GIGS OF RAM, BABY!!   (My new computer is only a year old and I lovelovelove it.)

 

 

[Julia Mae]

I posted twice and can't delete.  Oh, well:

 

 

 

 

[Carol the Dabbler]

  The library is in a town a 15-minute drive away.  I've never asked what sort of service they're hooked up to.

 

If they have DSL, you can see how well they stream.

 

Streaming for me had everything to do with how much RAM I have and not much to do with my DSL.  I have the cheapest, lowest speed you can get and I get everything just fine.  But I also have 8 GIGS OF RAM, BABY!!   (My new computer is only a year old and I lovelovelove it.)

 

Right, I'm planning to ask them.

 

8 gig, Good Lord.  The first computer I programmed had 8 kilobytes (and it did business data processing just fine).

 

[Carol the Dabbler]

I posted twice and can't delete.  Oh, well:

 

 

If that happens again, you can hide the post, which means that no one except staff can see it.  Or -- you could just edit in a nice picture!

 

[Julia Mae]

I'm going to edit in one more nice thing here, then I swear I'm going to post on topic tomorrow.   But I think I have to make a diagram.  It was my original idea, and now that Mofftiss indicates (possibly) that the solution can be seen in the series, not just the episode, I am feeling more confident. 

 

I just finished the first draft of a huge project I have and took the whole day off just messing about, so I shall become a serious Sherlock investigator tomorrow just before I become a serious writer, again.  (BTW, my first PC was also 8 and 8:  8 k RAM and 800 in the hard drive.  ACER.  I loved it so much.)

 

Anyway - back to work tomorrow: "Writing is rewriting."   So let's just feel very good looking at this from Japan:

 

[YouDoCount]

One thing I still don't understand about this episode(I've watched it 7 times in less than 2 days now ._.) is the breadcrumb of sorts that led Sherlock to the children. I mean, Sherlock thought that the boy who read all the spy books would think to do that, but how could Moriarty possible know he would leave any clues about the fact he was being kidnapped, never mind one that fitted in so perfectly with the Grimm Story, Hansel and Gretel.

And then, of course, the girl screaming at the sight of Sherlock. It just seems like there's something big missing here. I mean, Sherlock suspected the boy would do that because he read spy books and knew there was a man at the door, but does that just mean that Moriarty left the clue, knowing Sherlock would be able to work it out, or was there something else going on here?

 

One theory I had but quickly dismissed was that the children where the cabbie's  kids from 'A Study in Pink' and Moriarty put a camera in the room, resulting in the children being showing a video of their shot dad being stood on/hurt by Sherlock. But then again, I can't remember what the children looked like from the first episode of series 1, but I don't think they looked alike anyway from what I remember.

 

Anyway that was a bit far-fetched, even for me, but I'm try to think of every possibility I can.

[Carol the Dabbler]

It had never occurred to me that Moriarty might have had a hand in planting the clues at the kidnapping site (other than the Grimm book, of course).  You're right, it may have been him who spilled the linseed oil.  But maybe it really was the boy -- I can't offhand think of any specific reason to favor either idea.  If it was Moriarty, do you think he knew that Sherlock could use particles that the oil had soaked loose from the kidnapper's shoes in order to find the children?  He clearly expected Sherlock to find them somehow.

 

On the other hand, I'm certain that Moriarty did prime the girl to fear Sherlock.

 

But I don't think they're the cabbie's kids.  Their father is the US Ambassador.  Of course, the cabbie was divorced, so his ex-wife might conceivably have married the Ambassador, so they'd be his step-kids.  But that seems like kind of a stretch.

 

[YouDoCount]

I just can't work out how Moriarty could have guessed that the boy would leave that trail, making it fit in with his story theme. It seems lie quite an odd coincidence to me.

I really hope they answer all of the questions series 2 has left in series 3!

[Carol the Dabbler]

Oh, OK, you think the boy spilled the oil, but Moriarty somehow guessed that he would.  I doubt that Moriarty would leave something that important to chance, so it seems more likely to me that either Moriarty did it himself (or rather, had one of his henchmen do it) or else it really was an unexpected reaction by the boy.

 

I really hope they answer all of the questions series 2 has left in series 3!

 

You're not alone!  
 

 

[Julia Mae]

Oh, OK, you think the boy spilled the oil, but Moriarty somehow guessed that he would.  I doubt that Moriarty would leave something that important to chance, so it seems more likely to me that either Moriarty did it himself (or rather, had one of his henchmen do it) or else it really was an unexpected reaction by the boy.

 

Couple things.  The breadcrumbs in the envelope weren't left until long after the kids were kidnapped and the linseed oil spilled.  They were the only ones left, there was no disturbance, they were taken in the night and not discovered until morning.  So Moriarty knew he did it, because he'd already done it. 

 

I don't think the breadcrumbs had much to do with linseed oil footprints, anyway.  Once you put the seal on the crumb  envelope together with the seal on the book envelope, the story is that the witch held them captive in a house made of candy.   I don't think you have to be SH to start checking abandoned candy factories or closed sweet shops.  And, there are other ways to collect samples left by the kidnapper's shoes even without the oil. 

 

[YouDoCount]

Ohh alright! You both helped clear that up a lot! Thank you

[Carol the Dabbler]

Julia Mae, I think YouDoCount was talking about figurative bread crumbs:

 

 

 

One thing I still don't understand about this episode(I've watched it 7 times in less than 2 days now ._.) is the breadcrumb of sorts that led Sherlock to the children. I mean, Sherlock thought that the boy who read all the spy books would think to do that, but how could Moriarty possible know he would leave any clues about the fact he was being kidnapped, never mind one that fitted in so perfectly with the Grimm Story, Hansel and Gretel.

 

She said "breadcrumb of sorts" which I assume means the oil footprints, which did serve as a trail.  But the story also had an envelope full of actual breadcrumbs, so it was easy to read it that way.

 

Nevertheless, you make a good point:  Even without the footprints, Sherlock still had the Grimm book and the envelope of bread crumbs, implying Hansel and Gretel, which should lead him to think they'd be at the witch's house (which was made of candy).  So the footprints were just a shortcut, and a way for him to show off!

 

[YouDoCount]

Ohh right, ok. Thank you!

 

I watched the Reichenbach Fall for the first time on Sunday. I'm about to watch it for the 9th time, I haven't ever been so obsessed to any film or episode in my life before. This is insane.

[Julia Mae]

Ohh right, ok. Thank you!

 

I watched the Reichenbach Fall for the first time on Sunday. I'm about to watch it for the 9th time, I haven't ever been so obsessed to any film or episode in my life before. This is insane.

 

Well, you have become demented in good company.  You might be interested in a series of posts on The Reichenbach Fall on my blog. 

 

[SH/LotR/Zelda Fan]

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Ohh right, ok. Thank you!

 

I watched the Reichenbach Fall for the first time on Sunday. I'm about to watch it for the 9th time, I haven't ever been so obsessed to any film or episode in my life before. This is insane.

Yeah...I would have if I was allowed!!! I managed to watch all the episodes at LEAST 3 times in 1 week...literally...that week my parents were in London a lot so I got lots of free time.

[YouDoCount]

It's actually not healthy. I'm currently watching the episode for the 18th time in 8 days.

 

It's still emotionally destroying me. I can't help wondering why Lestrade wasn't at the funeral though?

[Selena]

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I can't help wondering why Lestrade wasn't at the funeral though?

Do you mean at the end of the episode? That was not Sherlock's funeral, just a visit to his grave.