Episode 3.3, "His Last Vow"

[T.o.b.y]

What is MI6, exactly?

[jesskayding]

What is MI6, exactly?

 

 

 

 

1. For the UK's domestic intelligence agency, see MI5. For other uses, see MI-6 (disambiguation). The Secret Intelligence Service (SIS), commonly known as MI6 (Military Intelligence, Section 6), is the British intelligence agency which supplies the British Government with foreign intelligence.

[T.o.b.y]

 

What is MI6, exactly?

 

 

 

 

1. For the UK's domestic intelligence agency, see MI5. For other uses, see MI-6 (disambiguation). The Secret Intelligence Service (SIS), commonly known as MI6 (Military Intelligence, Section 6), is the British intelligence agency which supplies the British Government with foreign intelligence.

 

 

Thank you! So MI6 is like the British CIA? Hmmm... in that case, Sherlock and Mary could be colleagues, in a way...

 

[jesskayding]

Yeah, if Sherlock is truly MI6, which is what Jenny hopes will be revealed in Season 4. Well based off her previous comment, it seems she's confident they will make it plain that he either is or isn't.

[Zain]

I once heard that MI6 has got a worse reputation than MI5. Is that true? And if yes, is there a reason behind that or just... mistrust?

[Arcadia]

I once heard that MI6 has got a worse reputation than MI5. Is that true? And if yes, is there a reason behind that or just... mistrust?

Worse in what way? Inefficient, ineffective, corrupt? Wonder how it compares with how Americans feel about the CIA and the FBI. Now I'm curious too!

[Carol the Dabbler]

I'm quite sure Mycroft could order him. Mycroft is the British Government.

Hmm, yes, of course Mycroft could order Sherlock. For all the good it'd do him.   

 

If I asked the MI6 question and they chose not to answer it, there is an answer there in S4.

 

Problem is, even if they DID answer it, Moftiss could still give us a (completely different) answer in S4.  (Moriarty is dead.)  Besides, it's really neither Freeman nor Abbington's bailiwick.  So if I were there, I wouldn't waste my question on that.

 

I once heard that MI6 has got a worse reputation than MI5. Is that true? And if yes, is there a reason behind that or just... mistrust?

Well, my impression is that the CIA (roughly the American MI6) has a worse reputation than the FBI (our "MI5") mostly because the CIA is likely to do things that the CIA could never get away with, simply because they operate elsewhere.  Like, it's harder to get away with assassinations right here at home.

 

[Zain]

 

I once heard that MI6 has got a worse reputation than MI5. Is that true? And if yes, is there a reason behind that or just... mistrust?

Worse in what way? Inefficient, ineffective, corrupt? Wonder how it compares with how Americans feel about the CIA and the FBI. Now I'm curious too!

 

 

Well, that is basically what I'd like to know

I just heard more people making scathing remarks about MI6 than MI5, and, if I am not mistaken, it is more often criticized in the media than MI5, too. English media, that is. Of course, I didn't do a study on it Just from my general expression, I've encountered more criticism on MI6 than on MI5 when I read English newspapers and blogs and so forth.

 

But maybe it's more to do with the fact that few people like their country's foreign politics and what "one's" secret service(s) do out there....

[Arcadia]

Well, my impression is that the CIA (roughly the American MI6) has a worse reputation than the FBI (our "MI5") mostly because the CIA is likely to do things that the CIA FBI (my edit) could never get away with, simply because they operate elsewhere.  Like, it's harder to get away with assassinations right here at home.

And also, I would say, when they screw up, it's more likely to have global implications than when the FBI screws up. And the FBI is not quite as secretive. And the CIA itself would claim that only their failures are publicized, not their successes. And spies are arguably dwelling in the morally grey zone to begin with; how do you trust someone who lies for a living? (I mean, who trusts actors and fiction writers? :D ) Etc etc. Who knows what the truth is? Not us, because the CIA won't tell us.....

[Bakerstreet Irregular]

Rearly, as much as Sherlock decides Mycroft for playing fast and lose with the likes of the International spy rings like the CA it really does sound like Sherlock has little love for that kind of thing.

 

Both Sherlock and Mycroft made it clear that Mycroft could not force Sherlock to work a case if Sherlock didn't want to. In The Mycroft threatened to make Sherlock work on the Bruce-Partington case. Sherlock snapped back with:I would like to see you try. Then in HLV Mycroft tells Sherlock that he, My croft, wants Sherlock to turn down an assignment so that means Sherlock does have the power to make a choice in the matter.

[sfmpco]

 

Both Sherlock and Mycroft made it clear that Mycroft could not force Sherlock to work a case if Sherlock didn't want to. In The Mycroft threatened to make Sherlock work on the Bruce-Partington case. Sherlock snapped back with:I would like to see you try. Then in HLV Mycroft tells Sherlock that he, My croft, wants Sherlock to turn down an assignment so that means Sherlock does have the power to make a choice in the matter.

 

Yes, he does have the power to decline but ONLY because he also has the power to accept because he has the skills and training.  Magnussen knew he was MI6.  The whole undercover for 2 years dismantling the Moriarty network was likely MI6.  I have further theories about this, but you have to wait for future chapters of my book...

[Bakerstreet Irregular]

It takes something far more than just skil and training to achieve that kind of power. What or whoever Sherlock is he is far from being a run of the mill operative.

[sfmpco]

It takes something far more than just skil and training to achieve that kind of power. What or whoever Sherlock is he is far from being a run of the mill operative.

 

Nothing run of the mill about Sherlock.  What all his other skills are, we don't know.  I hope we get some glimpses in S4.  He's a sure shot...that much we know.  He shot smiley's face dead on.

[Bakerstreet Irregular]

No there isn't anything run of mill about Sherlock. He doesn't consider himself "The Commonwealth" and he can make even Mycroft hop to it if he needs anything. Mycroft may be "The British Government" to a certain point but not so much for Sherlock himself.

[sfmpco]

This Tumbler blog came up in my Twitter feed or maybe my Facebook feed... anyhow, nice interview with Amanda Abbington about HLV at the end... http://elliebec.tumblr.com/post/97662303477/we-started-filming-in-april-and-we-finished-in

[Bakerstreet Irregular]

Well...hadn't forgotten that Mary had shot Sherlock....who could ever forget that!  But yeah there are a lot of people trying their hardest to understand "WHY?!?"

[sfmpco]

Well, we may never get a completely satisfactory answer to that, just like there was never a completely satisfactory answer to how SH survived the fall.

[Bakerstreet Irregular]

I get the feeling that the SH survival answer is vague because it's Canon....Mary....a whole different kettle of fish. I have some....I do say "some" hope that they are not done telling Mary's story.

[sfmpco]

Oh I hope there's a LOT more to Mary's story.  Who is she really?  Inquiring minds want to know.  And just what was her association with Magnussen that he would go after her with blackmail?  

[Carol the Dabbler]

Heavens, I should hope we'll hear more!

 

 

 

She didn’t mean it. She just did it because she was really scared.

 

At least we now know AA's take on "why" -- and she not only played Mary, she had also read Moffat's original script and worked with the director -- so that may be the most authoritative word we ever get.

 

[Arcadia]

 

It takes something far more than just skil and training to achieve that kind of power. What or whoever Sherlock is he is far from being a run of the mill operative.

 

Nothing run of the mill about Sherlock.  What all his other skills are, we don't know.  I hope we get some glimpses in S4.  He's a sure shot...that much we know.  He shot smiley's face dead on.

 

He missed the Golem, though.

 

Sherlock's such an independent, self-confident cuss, I really, really can't imagine him putting up with the kind of training agents go through. He'd be tossed out the first day as an unsuitable candidate, imo.

[jesskayding]

I'm lost, so lost.

[sfmpco]

He missed the Golem but to be fair, that was largely a shot in the dark.

[Bakerstreet Irregular]

Plus he had just been strangled and bashed about and there was a strob light affect going on. Hard to hit a target under those conditions I would imagine.

[Slithytove]

I've been pondering Sherlock's remark about Mary being unable to shoot CAM because her own husband would become a suspect, as they had broken into the building. It doesn't make sense to me.

 

For a start, they didn't break in. Janine let them in, and presumably she would confirm that when she recovered consciousness. Even if she couldn't remember, due to the head injury, the ring would still be in Sherlock's pocket. Admittedly, it would be a bit odd to bring along a friend when you are proposing, but Sherlock is odd. It wouldn't be hard for John to stick to that story.

 

Also, Janine and the guard were both knocked out. Surely one of them must have caught a glimpse of the assailant who attacked them at close quarters. Presumably she was masked, but it could not have been John unless he brought a complete change of clothing with him and somehow disposed of the black outfit.

 

Anyway, why would he have shot Sherlock? Sherlock says she couldn't shoot CAM because of John becoming a suspect, but surely the fact that he himself would witness the murder would be a bigger problem for her. The only scenario in which John could become a suspect is one where Sherlock is dead too, otherwise he could immediately exonerate John. So she would have to kill Sherlock too. Now, the police might suspect John had a motive for killing CAM but why would he kill Sherlock as well? Seems highly unlikely.

 

The bullets would have come from the same gun and, even if John had disobeyed Sherlock's earlier instruction about not bringing his gun, it would not be linked to John in any way. And how would he have disposed of the murder weapon, anyway?

 

I don't see how John was in any real danger of becoming a suspect.