Episode 3.2, "The Sign of Three"

[Alex the Dabbler]

Based on the look on Sherlock's face after seeing Janine dancing with the comics and SciFi geek, I agree that's a big reason he left the wedding reception early.  I think he was hoping to dance with Janine.

[Bakerstreet Irregular]

 

Based on the look on Sherlock's face after seeing Janine dancing with the comics and SciFi geek, I agree that's a big reason he left the wedding reception early.  I think he was hoping to dance with Janine.

 

  I got that impression too. I mean, she cheered him pretty enthusiastically after he played John and Mary's waltz and he did toss her his boutineer and she flashed him a bright smile, I was kind of hoping she was going to.

[Carol the Dabbler]

Wasn't she supposed to?  He said something about the best man and bridesmaid being expected to dance together.  Seems like he could have just "claimed his right" -- but maybe he didn't want to butt in because she was having such a good time with what's-his-name.
 

... I also wish that while John still had his mustache, they had dressed the two of them up in late Victorian dress as Holmes and Watson and taken a few photographs. They'd look just right.

 
I think John would have looked even more classic-Watsonish with the mustache that Martin Freeman had for a cameo appearance in Mr. Selfridge a year ago.  (I wonder if they intentionally gave him a somewhat scruffy one for Sherlock, because the script called for everyone to criticize it.)

[Bakerstreet Irregular]

Yeah, as best man he was supposed to dance with the maid of honor, they did practice, but he did kind of throw this geek at Janine at the reception, pointing out how his date didn't really like him, Not picking the piece of string off his shoulder, not pointing out the grease spot on his neck. But like you said, he probably felt awkward about it all.

[mangopony]

Did anyone see the news about the Q&A the cast did at Apple? Apparently there was a deleted scene from the stag do of John and Sherlock ending up in a gay bar.

 

Wish outtakes and deleted scenes were on the DVDs :-(

http://www.independent.co.uk/arts-entertainment/tv/news/sherlock-stars-reveal-gay-club-scene-was-cut-from-series-three-9109602.html

[spburns23]

^{was the blue danube used in this episode the londin phil version from 1965 or so as featured in 2001 a space odyssey?  Sounded like it.....}

 

[Bakerstreet Irregular]

You might try a Google search on Sherlock Sign of Three music. Or something like that. But you're right. It is "The Blue Danube Waltz".

[Carol the Dabbler]

It would also be interesting to know whether they used the popular recording of that song that nobody seems to know the official name of, or whether they used a sound-alike cover in order to save royalty fees.  If they used the "original" of either piece, the credits will say so.

 

My first guess would be that both were re-recorded for the show, in which case there might be no specific mention in the credits, other than who wrote the song.

 

[Bakerstreet Irregular]

It is listed as "The Blue Danube Waltz" when I Googled the Sherlock Season 3 episode 2 soundtrack.

[Carol the Dabbler]

I'm sure you're right about the title.  I was just wondering whether the credits at the end of the show might say who performed it, since that was spburns23's original question.  Will try to remember to look next time we watch, though that may be a while, since we just saw it a couple of days ago.

 

And hello, spburns23 -- welcome to Sherlock Forum!    I hope you're having a good time here!

 

[Bakerstreet Irregular]

Oops, sorry about that, Carol. Didn't understand the question, I guess.

[Bakerstreet Irregular]

It may have been a recording. Sherlock played the violin but the rest of the dancing was apparently played by a DJ?

[Sacker]

Great stuff. It had the compassion from Sherlock that I really wanted Empty Hearse to have. I was told to hang in there and I'd be rewarded. I was. Well done as always. The last thirty minutes or so were particularly well done. Not sure how I feel about Mary yet, but we'll see. Something strange about her, just can't put my finger on it. Maybe tomorrow night will shed some light (when I watch Last Vow).

[T.o.b.y]

Not sure how I feel about Mary yet, but we'll see. Something strange about her, just can't put my finger on it. Maybe tomorrow night will shed some light (when I watch Last Vow).

 

It sure will! And let me point you to the "Mary Morstan" thread already - just in case there will be a few things you might feel the need to discuss after that episode...

 

[Sacker]

*looks around the room nervously*. ;-)

[Carol the Dabbler]

I will just point out, Sacker, that "Last Vow" was written by Steven Moffat.  It's a good episode, but it's very -- Moffat.

[Sacker]

As a Doctor Who uber-nerd, I'll be ready.  in fact, after it originally aired there were more than a few mentions of its Moffatness. 

For the record, I'm not a Moffat hater the way some of my fellow Whovians are.  They get pretty dug in on the Who board.  I have no problems what so ever with his handling of The Doctor.  Certainly not with his involvement on Sherlock.  Perfect so far.

[Carol the Dabbler]

Then you should be fine.  Might want to brace yourself just a bit, though.

 

[Sacker]

Then you should be fine.  Might want to brace yourself just a bit, though.

 

 

Uh oh.    

 

I hope it's not some crazy twist that I have to wait years to get closure on.  I saw an interview where Moffat mentions it being quite some time before they go again.  Which, by the way, I'm more than fine with.  Not rushing to produce has led to TV being a very deep format these days.  I was talking to a friend of mine about that just yesterday.  Shows are taking long breaks and  putting more work into story, characters, and production. It's showing in the final product.

 

All of the shows I follow closely have gone with this same philosophy and, I think, are outstanding because of it. All of them can easily hold their own against anything coming out of Hollywood.

Doctor Who

Downton Abbey

Sherlock

[Carol the Dabbler]

Some of us have found that it takes more than one viewing to digest it all, but it is relatively self-contained -- except for what Moftiss are apparently thinking of as their big cliff-hanger, which will not bother you a bit, I promise you.

 

[Sacker]

Thoughts in the Last Vow thread....

[T.o.b.y]

Based on the look on Sherlock's face after seeing Janine dancing with the comics and SciFi geek, I agree that's a big reason he left the wedding reception early.  I think he was hoping to dance with Janine.

 

Maybe... but just that "disappointment" alone would not have been enough to prompt that exit, I think.

 

I wonder whether, when he began to date Janine in an attempt to get at Magnussen, Sherlock saw it as an experiment in the art of courtship, as trying out whether he really could have a girl-friend and if so, if he would like it - since he was obviously feeling pretty forlorn at the end of the wedding. I guess the answers are, yes he can (at least for a while and up to a certain point), but he didn't really warm to the concept (at least not with Janine), even though he did seem to be enjoying himself quite a bit.

 

[Slithytove]

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Based on the look on Sherlock's face after seeing Janine dancing with the comics and SciFi geek, I agree that's a big reason he left the wedding reception early. I think he was hoping to dance with Janine.

Maybe... but just that "disappointment" alone would not have been enough to prompt that exit, I think.

 

I wonder whether, when he began to date Janine in an attempt to get at Magnussen, Sherlock saw it as an experiment in the art of courtship, as trying out whether he really could have a girl-friend and if so, if he would like it - since he was obviously feeling pretty forlorn at the end of the wedding. I guess the answers are, yes he can (at least for a while and up to a certain point), but he didn't really warm to the concept (at least not with Janine), even though he did seem to be enjoying himself quite a bit.

There is an interesting meta on archiveofourown.org, by a writer called Tammany, which explores the character arcs in S3 and it has a chapter on Sherlock & Janine. This suggests that one of the reasons Sherlock killed CAM was that the latter gloated about hurting Janine. Sounds pretty far fetched, given Sherlock's own ruthless exploitation of her feelings, but bear with me...

 

Tammany points out that ACD's Holmes would have had a much easier time courting the blackmailer's servant (the original plot device on which Sherlock's relationship with Janine is based), as romance below-stairs in a Victorian household probably didn't involve much more than love letters and public flirtation. That approach wouldn't cut much ice with a worldly, 21st century girl like Janine. Even if Sherlock explains that he is a virgin( if he is! ), she would presumably expect a reasonably intimate relationship with someone arousing and capable of being aroused. Janine, who is no fool, believes she is in a real, intimate relationship which progresses rapidly towards marriage - surely she would not be fooled if he had not been convincing as a boyfriend, not only physically but emotionally and socially too.

 

Tammany suggests, and I think she is right, that it is unlikely that Sherlock is a brilliant sexual liar and more likely that it is a bit of "method acting", i.e. allowing himself to live the role whilst knowing, in another part of his mind, that it is done solely for the case. Maybe, in the part of his mind which is acting the role of boyfriend, he is enjoying the love, the intimacy, the kudos of having a girlfriend and the possibility of getting married - even though he knows he is only playing.

 

Of course, when she visits him in hospital, Janine says that "just once would have been nice" and Sherlock replies that he was waiting until they were married. This may mean that they have not had sex at all. Tammany thinks it might refer to unprotected sex. It could also be a reference to a sexual activity they had not tried yet. For instance.....well, I won't spell it out on an open forum, where there may be younger readers, but I'm sure we can all think of things which an experienced lady might expect from a relationship but an inexperienced gentleman might feel a bit daunting....

 

Also, she says she knows what kind of man he is, which might mean that she believes he is gay. However, she has recently found out he lied to her and manipulated her feelings for him, so she is entitled to a certain amount of bitterness.

 

So maybe, in a way, Janine was Sherlock's first girlfriend and maybe he did enjoy being a boyfriend, even if it was only acting. Then CAM boasts about hurting and humiliating Janine. Sherlock stands like a stone throughout John's ordeal. It upsets him but he knows John is a soldier and can take it. When CAM mentions Janine, Sherlock turns to glare at him and, almost immediately, CAM is dead. Sherlock has many reasons to murder CAM, but is it the treatment of Janine which finally motivates him to kill?

 

I think it is a really interesting idea. For it to work, you would have to believe that Sherlock was able to assume the lover's role so deeply that he began to experience genuine feelings when he was acting, and also that he was trying to save the Watsons but might not have been driven to murder if Janine had not been the last straw.

 

What do you think?

[Carol the Dabbler]

Magnussen's gloating over how he'd treated Janine may have been the last straw -- but Sherlock was looking absolutely murderous before that, when Magnussen was taunting John.

 

As for why he left the reception early, doesn't he have a hard time dealing with large groups of people?  (I believe that was why he recorded that "Many Happy Returns" video instead of attending John's birthday party -- which would surely have been a good deal smaller than the reception.)  He may have felt relieved to be out of there, rather than lonely or alienated.

 

[T.o.b.y]

Magnussen's gloating over how he'd treated Janine may have been the last straw -- but Sherlock was looking absolutely murderous before that, when Magnussen was taunting John.

 

As for why he left the reception early, doesn't he have a hard time dealing with large groups of people?  (I believe that was why he recorded that "Many Happy Returns" video instead of attending John's birthday party -- which would surely have been a good deal smaller than the reception.)  He may have felt relieved to be out of there, rather than lonely or alienated.

 

I sure would have been relieved in his place, which is why I like your interpretation a lot, Carol. But before he left, he was looking around, trying to make contact with people (specifically, women) without the aid of John and Mary, and found it wasn't working. Nobody was giving him the cold shoulder, but I think at that moment, he was shown that you can't just throw off the "sociopath" role like a coat whenever you don't want it. It's great protection usually, but it also leads to girls thinking he wouldn't want their attention, that he would be bored and annoyed if they tried to dance and maybe flirt with him. So I think the ending of The Sign of Three is about Sherlock being caught in the "armor" he made for himself and finally accepting that you can't have (or be) everything.

 

As for Janine. I really don't want to make too much of her, because I don't like to believe Sherlock would seriously fall in love with a woman like her. Irene, fine. Molly, okay. But not "tabloid whore" Janine! Still, there's no denying, I think, that John's marriage and the discovery that he had moved out of Baker St and wasn't coming back left a big "vacancy" in Sherlock's life and it is entirely plausible and understandable that he tries to fill it in some way. First he experimented with taking Molly along to crime scenes - didn't work, because she made him understand pretty fast that while she still loves him and enjoys his company, she was engaged and besides, wasn't going to be a stand-in for anybody. Then he tried having a regular girl-friend (and while I don't think he had sex with Janine at all, I do think they must have been physically intimate. We know they kissed and she went into the bathtub with him and so on), which seemed fun, but not fun enough to keep it going after her usefulness ended (who knows, though - that cottage might become one of his "bolt holes").

 

I makes sense that while Sherlock had no scruples using Janine to break into her boss's office and pretending to want to get engaged to her, he might still have felt affection for and been outraged at another man's mistreatment if her. I mean, look at how he treats other people he loves. He certainly objects to what the villains on this show do to John in their turn, and still he's tried out drugs on him and used his grief to make his fake death believable to the public. He's Sherlock Holmes and Moffat can claim he's not really a sociopath all he wants to; the way he writes him, I beg to differ.