What about Sherlock's feelings for Molly?

[Elementary]

I actually think that the Sherlock and Molly have great chemistry on screen (just watch this video, wow!) but practically, I am just worried that Molly would not be able to satisfy Sherlock's constant need for intellectual stimulation. (In the way that Irene would, although if she were ever to have a "real" relationship with Sherlock, the game would not be as fun anyway - so it's true for anyone).

 

However, one scene that I think showed Sherlock's connection to Molly is where Molly was talking to him in his Mind Palace (haha, oh Sherlock ) as he was dying. That was important! It shows that he does feel a really close connection with Molly even if it's not quite romantic at this point. And the way Molly broke off her engagement also suggests something... 

 

2016 can't come soon enough!!  

[Caya]

Hello Elementary and welcome to the forum!

 

I assume you also meant Molly, not Mary, in your first line (the video would suggest as much) ... if not, you'd be our first Sherlock/Mary (Sherry? ) shipper, I think .

[Elementary]

Hello Elementary and welcome to the forum!

 

I assume you also meant Molly, not Mary, in your first line (the video would suggest as much) ... if not, you'd be our first Sherlock/Mary (Sherry? ) shipper, I think .

 

Hi, thank you! 

 

Nope, definitely not Mary! Although I think she kinda likes Sherlock. Platonically... of course. 

[Arcadia]

I actually think that the Sherlock and Molly have great chemistry on screen (just watch this video, wow!) but practically, I am just worried that Molly would not be able to satisfy Sherlock's constant need for intellectual stimulation. (In the way that Irene would, although if she were ever to have a "real" relationship with Sherlock, the game would not be as fun anyway - so it's true for anyone).

 

However, one scene that I think showed Sherlock's connection to Molly is where Molly was talking to him in his Mind Palace (haha, oh Sherlock ) as he was dying. That was important! It shows that he does feel a really close connection with Molly even if it's not quite romantic at this point. And the way Molly broke off her engagement also suggests something... 

 

2016 can't come soon enough!!

I'd be even more worried that she'd be overwhelmed by his need to dominate. She'd need to learn how to take him down a peg like John and Mary do. I'd love to see that, actually.

 

Anderson was in his mind palace too, I hope that doesn't mean he feels a close connection to "Phillip"! Altho that would explain why Sherlock chose him to reveal the explanation for the Fall......

[Elementary]

 

I'd be even more worried that she'd be overwhelmed by his need to dominate. She'd need to learn how to take him down a peg like John and Mary do. I'd love to see that, actually.

 

Anderson was in his mind palace too, I hope that doesn't mean he feels a close connection to "Phillip"! Altho that would explain why Sherlock chose him to reveal the explanation for the Fall......

 

 

You already saw it - she did start to do that whan she slapped Sherlock and brought him to his senses even when John couldn't. I was cheering for Molly then even though I didn't particularly like her in the first season.

 

I guess, but it was Molly who saved him (for the 2nd time) by "instructing" him how to fall; the knowledge he gained from her saved him, and I imagine he values that a lot.

[Arcadia]

Yeah, but he wasn't trying to manipulate her at that point. She would need to learn how to stand up to him when he's in full-blown narcissist mode. Believe me, it's not easy.

[jesskayding]

Are you joking as if you have one on one experience with Sherlock or are you speaking from experience

[Arcadia]

Experience, alas. Not with Sherlock, tho!

[jesskayding]

So are you the narcissist, or is it a person you're dating, or is a family member or friend? An inquiring mind wants to know.

[Arcadia]

I prefer to take the Sherlockian way out and just smile enigmatically.

[jesskayding]

Balance of probability, you are the narcissist. 

[Arcadia]

Oh god, I hope not! I don't think so. Eeeep. If I am, put me down now, before I destroy again......

[jesskayding]

So do people really think Sherlock has feelings for Molly? I've seen that he wishes he could give her what she wants, but knows he doesn't feel "that" way about her.

[Arcadia]

Me, no, I don't think he does. Not in that way. I think they could be friends, tho, if they let themselves be.

 

Or, more accurately, if the writers would let them be...

[sfmpco]

Well, I think he was absolutely genuine with her the whole time he was telling her that she counted - no, MATTERED - the most.  More than John?  More than Mrs. Hudson?  More than Lestrade? She mattered the MOST.   He was listening to her, not filtering her, but I think he also realized when he saw the ring that he had missed any little opportunity with her and then he immediately gave her congratulations.  If he hadn't seen the ring, they would have had a first "date" of fish and chips.  After all, he did ask her out, so that constitutes a date.  And they had had a good day of bonding until that dang ring got in the way.  Of course, saying that she mattered the most is in no way a statement of being in love with her.  It is, however, a statement of a type of deep bonding he has with her, and it wouldn't take much to push that over the edge into something more.

 

On the other hand... on the OTHER hand of playing slightly out of canon since we have no freaking idea what is coming in Series 4....

 

On the other hand I am writing him in an increasing downward spiral since getting off that jet, and I'm letting him have something with Molly, but it is part of that spiral.  Why?  Because I see a man whose heart has been ripped apart and he can't hold the facade because he doesn't know how to deal with the overwhelming emotions he feels.  He's murdered someone.  He just thought he would never see all the people he loves again, he thought he was going to his death, then Mycroft yanks his chain and pulls the plane back.  He and John didn't have the greatest goodbye, and John will be very shortly busy with a baby so not very available... and I suspect Sherlock is a MESS. You can't have the emotional rug ripped out from under you over and over and over and say oh we'll just go back to the way things were.  Nope. (pop that P the way BC does)  And then there's the Moriarty business AGAIN which although I feel is totally fake, it haunts him.  I think it's very possible that he would have a meltdown.  And I think he would likely be feeling very vulnerable and need -- no, DESPERATELY need to feel alive, because he's got to be numb from the shock of everything.  

 

So I could see that he, being completely emotionally raw, would do things he'd never done before, like explore something more with Molly, even though there's an element of him using her to comfort himself, because although she can say, "I love you," he cannot say the words in return.  So she would be a willing participant in his using her, because she will hope....always hope... that he will love her.  But he has inner "demons" that she can't fix, and they are starting to come out in spades.

 

Alright, so that's where I would take it... but it's total speculation on post HLV.  First five chapters are done.  Working on the 6th.

[Arcadia]

That makes perfect sense to me, actually. But I can't see anything lasting with Molly come of it, unless one of them truly has a character conversion. Either he would need to become less domineering and manipulative, or she would have to learn to go toe to toe with him, and enjoy it. Otherwise he'd just overwhelm her, and eventually she'd either lose her identity in his (which would bore him) or she'd finally get sick of it, and quit. Either way, she gets badly hurt. Actually, no matter what, she gets hurt, unless she finally stops regarding him romantically and accepts him as just a friend. Imho. (Obviously! )
 
I love the idea of him being able to have a female friend, actually ... until Mary, he seemed to regard all women as rather silly and annoying. A real, deep friendship with a woman who understands what he's really like, accepts him as is, doesn't think she can change him, and doesn't want a commitment ... that might lead somewhere. (Oh gawd, I think I just set him up to have a crush on Mary....  )
  
Poor Molly, I love her, and I think she'd be good for him, but I think he'd destroy her. Unless she changes dramatically. Which I can see Moftiss doing, actually .... Molly the BAMF Amazon! But then she wouldn't want him anymore ......

[Arcadia]

PS -- I like your writing, but I'm holding off reading it until it's finished ... cuz, I dunno, I'm like that. Looking forward to it, tho, the way you write the characters sounds right in my head, if you see what I mean.

[sfmpco]

Well, I think Molly has grown a lot... and just the fact that she slapped him 3X in Barts lab and he didn't ever try to stop her.  One slap most could get away with but he just let her continue to slap him... then he had a little snarkiness afterwards... but he let her give him his come-uppance.  She could never have done that in episode 1, nor do I think he would have let her.  She was barely good for anything but getting his coffee then.

 

Now he even uses her slaps in his mind palace to focus him and keep him alive.  And as Baker Street Babes have correctly analyzed, she has, in his mind palace, become all medical knowledge to him.

 

http://bakerstreetbabes.com/femme-friday-molly-hooper/

 

I do think there's a very good chance for Molly to get hurt but I would think she'd be very aware of that, and I think she'd be willing to take the risk with him if she felt there was anything coming her way from him.  Maybe I'm just projecting onto Molly except that I've had some "Sherlock" types in my life who if they'd give me just me a little I'd have given them the world.  Oh, she wanted to go after him so badly in TEH but for that damn engagement ring.  And then she just falls in love with him all over again in TSOT during the best man speech, to the point which she has removed her engagement ring by the end of the episode.  She knows where her heart really lies.

 

I could never write Sherlock as a guy who can express his feelings verbally.  For him to outright say he ever "loves" someone would roll off his tongue with more difficulty than remembering Lestrade's first name.  For him to even understand love greater than friendship would take a long time.  I'm not saying he can't get there but it is something he shields himself from and which has become almost alien to him.  He can see it in others, but he doesn't have a base of experience to temper that with.  I'm not even saying I can get him there or that that's my goal.  It isn't.  

 

He got "beaten" by Irene but only because he was drugged.  I imagine that had he not been drugged he would have deflected any blow she tried to deliver.  Of course, he was still a little high when Molly slapped him, but not in loss of control the way he was when Irene drugged him.  Still, he could have deflected Molly's slaps and chose not to which to me says he respects her enough to let her give him that discipline.

 

And let's not forget that her flat is one of his bolt holes...specifically her bedroom.  She makes it clear that that is HIS space during those times, however, which means she's been relegated to the sofa.  Still, she is his anchor, his safety.  And if he were to ever really explore the possibility of more with a woman, she is the safest one, because she already sees him for who he is and he knows it and is appreciative of it.

 

[sfmpco]

That makes perfect sense to me, actually. But I can't see anything lasting with Molly come of it, unless one of them truly has a character conversion. Either he would need to become less domineering and manipulative, or she would have to learn to go toe to toe with him, and enjoy it.

 

 

Also remember from her own blog that she KNEW perfectly well that he was using flattery to manipulate her.  And that she willingly chose to let him have his way.

 

http://www.mollyhooper.co.uk/blog/25march

[sfmpco]

I should also add that I have read a LOT of Sherlolly fanfic, and most of it has the characters so out of character that you don't even recognize them.  I did read one sort of interesting one where Molly ended up killing Moriarty by literally cutting out his beating heart, and you realize  this girl has a psychopath in her just like the rest of them!   

[jesskayding]

Mmmmm

Not buying it. I think he saw the ring the entire time. Think about who Sherlock is. We were told in SIP. Lestrade: well maybe the phone fell out of the case when you brought it in.

Sherlock: and I didn't notice... Me!?

 

As soon as he saw her in front of locker upon his return he saw the ring on her finger. Perhaps because she really does see him, she matters the most, as his best friend, who happens to be a woman. If Sherlock wanted her he would EaSiLy have her by now.

 

I mean he was asking her to solve crimes, she came over hoping to have dinner with him. Shame on Molly by the way. Don't get engaged to someone you don't love & you're just trying to make them into the person you truly love.

 

Sherlock wasn't asking her on a date. Even though she wasn't John, she certainly was filling in for him. Sherlock & John would often grab a bite to eat together after solving a crime. That was not a romantic gesture. Sherlock also let her know the day of crime solving was to thank her. Seriously he was throwing the girl a bone. He wanted her to know he was happy for her, hence the peck on the cheek. Furthermore he wasn't jealous, he was sad per he was hoping to have Molly as his PA, per he was convinced John was done with him.

[Arcadia]

 

That makes perfect sense to me, actually. But I can't see anything lasting with Molly come of it, unless one of them truly has a character conversion. Either he would need to become less domineering and manipulative, or she would have to learn to go toe to toe with him, and enjoy it.

 

 

Also remember from her own blog that she KNEW perfectly well that he was using flattery to manipulate her.  And that she willingly chose to let him have his way.

 

http://www.mollyhooper.co.uk/blog/25march

 

Well, that's exactly what I mean. She shouldn't let people use her, no matter how much she cares for them, or how aware she is. But if she had gotten into his face and told him off, I'd have hope for her. And she'd need to enjoy the battling, because it would be constant.

 

And to resort to slapping him; a bit not good. She needs to handle him verbally. She did fight back a little when he asked her to work out the alcohol consumption; that was her best moment to date as far as dealing with him goes. But he still got his way, so it remains to be seen whether she can truly stand up to him or not. I'm hoping that's where they are taking her character, actually.

 

By the way, I'm not criticising anything you might be writing (haven't read it yet, how could I!!!!) -- I'm referring strictly to the TV version of Molly. I've read a few fanfics that have managed pretty convincingly (to me) to have Molly & Sherlock end up together, so it can be done. I just don't think Moftiss will.

 

I plan to read your story, and based on what I've read of yours so far, I expect to enjoy it. I just like to wait until they are complete, mostly cuz I forget what happens between chapters if I dont' get to the next one right away!

[Arcadia]

And then she just falls in love with him all over again in TSOT during the best man speech, to the point which she has removed her engagement ring by the end of the episode.

She did? I missed that completely. The last I saw of her she was still smiling and dancing with Tom ..... ???

[Arcadia]

Sherlock wasn't asking her on a date. Even though she wasn't John, she certainly was filling in for him. Sherlock & John would often grab a bite to eat together after solving a crime. That was not a romantic gesture. Sherlock also let her know the day of crime solving was to thank her. Seriously he was throwing the girl a bone. He wanted her to know he was happy for her, hence the peck on the cheek. Furthermore he wasn't jealous, he was sad per he was hoping to have Molly as his PA, per he was convinced John was done with him.

I agree, he was offering her friendship, not romance. Unlike Irene, to Sherlock dinner just means dinner!

[Bendydoodle Cantaloupe]

... he wasn't jealous, he was sad per he was hoping to have Molly as his PA, per he was convinced John was done with him.

 

You can tell from the whole mind palace scene in HLV. The Mind Palace Molly sometimes says "we" where people normally say you - "We need to focus", "On your back, gravity's working for us", etc. So in Sherlock's mind, he and Molly are a team.