Eurus

[Arcadia]

Maybe Eurus' interest is akin to Moriarty's fascination with Sherlock, and that's why she wants to meet Jim in the first place. I don't think it's love ... obsession is a good word.

 

It could be as simple as she still just wants to play with Sherlock. In some ways she's supposed to be child-like, which kind of makes sense because she probably hasn't had a lot of the experiences most people have that help them become adults. And also maybe because, like a child, the world doesn't make sense to her?

[bedelia1984]

I like the idea of Eurus being a bit childlike, because it explains the girl on the plane. 

 

Also, it makes sense to view her as an instinctual character rather than someone who is totally aware of the psychology and emotional weight behind what she's doing. You know, kind of like how a kid just knows how to do what will drive their parents crazy, without putting too much thought into the whys and wherefores? So maybe that's how she knows what will push Sherlock's buttons, just going on instinct.

[Doe]

I read one opinion about Eurus on a blog (sorry I can't remember which one) that said an overload of feelings had driven her mad.

 

Before that, I had been viewing her as limited emotionally, but it is interesting to consider the reverse- that as well as having too many thoughts, she had too many feelings ("I lost count") and that was partly what overwhelmed her and led to her madness? Any credence to that?

 

I completely agree about the fact that a mentally ill person can know how to look sane. Also, institutionalisation breeds manipulative behaviour. If a person is trapped, it is the only way to gain control, sometimes the only way to survive. She's capable of 'acting' normal, but I think in order for it to be worth her while, there has to be an ulterior motive. She couldn't do it in sincerity. A bit like Moriarty as Jim from IT. The fun is in the deception.

 

Hello bedelia1984,

 

Can i ask you something?

 

I didn't understand while I was watching. "I lost count" Can you explain that?

 

My sincere regards

[Carol the Dabbler]

If you're asking what the phrase usually means, it means that the person was counting something, but then they got interrupted or distracted, so they forgot what number they had gotten to.

[bedelia1984]

Hi Doe! As Carol said above, that's the meaning, that there were too many to keep count. She said it about Sherlock, but I wondered was it a comment on herself too, that she perceives too much complexity in emotion, too many different kinds, to separate and identify them

[Doe]

Thanks for your help. I get it now.

[Janine M. Adler]

My question is how realistic is Eurus' mind controlling power? It doesn't make sense at all.

[Surelock]

My question is how realistic is Eurus' mind controlling power? It doesn't make sense at all.

 

You're right. They're not realistic at all.

 

Honestly I think Moffatiss gave her mind control powers because they didn't know how else to make her smarter than Mycroft. Also they wanted to one up Moriarty (which is basically impossible).

 

At least Culverton Smith was a realistic villain.

[Carol the Dabbler]

She could be using some sort of hypnotic technique. It kinda sounded a bit that way to me on that tape of her talking with the governor. Get a person to agree with something that's just a bit "off" then go a step further and so on. Power of suggestion and all that. Unless the victim had a rock-solid sense of his own self-worth (and how many people do?), then given frequent opportunities it should be possible to undermine their resolve in a relatively short time.

[Arcadia]

I agree with Carol, I think it's supposed to be a believable "power", albeit taken to an extreme. I've been thinking she's meant to be a charismatic personality, like David Koresh, Charles Manson, Marshall Applewhite, etc.

[T.o.b.y]

Me too. I don't think they meant to give her X-powers or anything, she's just supposed to be an extremely good manipulator the way Sherlock has almost uncanny deductive abilities. Perhaps she does use a form of hypnotism to help her along sometimes (or good ol' fashioned Victorian "mesmerism" as a nod to Doyle :-D)

[Surelock]

Is hypnosis/mesmerism even real? Personally I don't think you can manipulate someone easily unless there's something mentally wrong with them in the first place. 

[Arcadia]

Yep, real. I got hypnotized once. Very restful.

This was in a meeting with a stress management/health counselor and about 20 of my office mates. He asked who wanted to try it, I raised my hand, followed instructions, etc. (It felt more like deep meditation than anything else I can describe.) When he brought me out of it, I looked around and was mortified to discover I was the only one who had volunteered. The rest of them were staring at me to see if I did anything bizarre. Twits. :D

 

Whether you can make people do anything against their nature while hypnotized, I don't know. I do remember the guy complimented me on being "very receptive", which I took to mean, not everyone is. So if you're looking for answers, and Eurus offers them to you, you might be more inclined to be swayed by her? But if you're wary, not so much? Dunno.

[Carol the Dabbler]

They say you can't be hypnotized to do anything you would not normally do. But you *can* be told to misinterpret what you see and hear, which can amount to the same thing.

 

For example, if they tell you that your best friend is a murderer in disguise, you could then be persuaded to "defend" yourself against them -- basically, you could be persuaded to attack your best friend.

 

And no, being "receptive" does not imply any sort of mental defect. In fact, I've heard (think I have this straight) that people with severe learning disabilities are almost impossible to hypnotize.

 

So, Arcadia, *did* you do anything bizarre? :D

[Arcadia]

I don't know, no one would give me a straight answer!

[Arcadia]

I've moved this thread from the Season 4 sub-forum to the Character sub-forum. Just posting this so it will pop up on the New Content page.

[Carol the Dabbler]

I'm still puzzled as to why (according to the DVD end credits) they're spelling this character's name as Eurus instead of the more common Euros -- especially since it sounds to me like they're pronouncing it with an O.

 

I've already mentioned maybe they didn't want it to look like a reference to European money. More recently it occurred to me that it could more logically be to avoid confusion with director Euros Lynn ("The Blind Banker").

[Arcadia]

I read somewhere it's because Euros is a male god, and Eurus is the feminization of that name. Although if I google it, it says both spellings are used for the same male god.

 

And Sherlock really does sound like a feminine name ... hm. Maybe the Holmes parents don't see gender? Or they accidentally gave the wrong names to their kids? This could explain so much ..... :P

[Carol the Dabbler]

To me, "Eurus" looks more masculine than "Euros" (which seems kinda neutral to me, since Eos is the Greek goddess of the dawn). But maybe that's because I studied Latin rather than Greek.

[J.P.]

To me both of those names sound extremely masculine. Probably because I'm programmed to define the gender of a word from it's ending (it's how Polish work) and - native German speakers may help me here, because I cannot find other words than Ausschuss and Fundus right now - do all/most German words ending with -us are masculine?

[Arcadia]

They both look rather masculine to me, too, but so does Madison, Riley, Chase, and a slew of other names that are given to American girls. And Sherlock sounds feminine to me, based on its meaning. And my real name, which is spelled slightly different than usual, was constantly misread as a boy's name when I was kid. So I give up.

[Amber§]

For example, if they tell you that your best friend is a murderer in disguise, you could then be persuaded to "defend" yourself against them -- basically, you could be persuaded to attack your best friend.

 

And no, being "receptive" does not imply any sort of mental defect. In fact, I've heard (think I have this straight) that people with severe learning disabilities are almost impossible to hypnotize.

 

 

Have you seen Hunger Games, the two last films? Peeta's mind was manipulated, adding torture, so he thought Katniss wanted to kill him.

So, Euros could have easily done mind manipulation in this way, maybe using also a sort of verbal torture, making pressure on special themes that worried the victims or something like that.

But we need a Psicologist to explain ahaha :D

 

[Lalarun]

To me both of those names sound extremely masculine. Probably because I'm programmed to define the gender of a word from it's ending (it's how Polish work) and - native German speakers may help me here, because I cannot find other words than Ausschuss and Fundus right now - do all/most German words ending with -us are masculine?

I think it's quite common.

For example there are all these words ending in -ismus, such as Kapitalismus, Extremismus, Autismus, Kommunismus, Impressionismus, but also Zirkus, Campus, Exitus (and probably many more).

There might be exceptions though.

It also doesn't really work for one syllable words with an au in the middle, such as Haus (neuter) or Maus (female). I guess that's because "au" is a diphtong on its own.

 

To me, "Eurus" looks more masculine than "Euros" (which seems kinda neutral to me, since Eos is the Greek goddess of the dawn). But maybe that's because I studied Latin rather than Greek.

They both look masculine to me, but then I learned Latin as well as Greek. So -us and -os are both endings I associate with masculine nouns.

I wondered about the goddess now because of the name ending in -os despite being female and found that in Greek it's apparently spelled Ἠώς. The typial masuline ending is -ος though. There are different o-sounds. I guess that makes a difference, only that you cannot distinguish these two in Latin letters. But then Euros (the male God) is Εὖρος, with the typical masculine ending. So that wouldn't really explain their name choice for a female child (like it works with the name Eos). I'm not an expert on this though, so there could be other factors playing a role in all of this. That's just what I tried to figure out from my knowledge of Greek I remember from highschool.

[J.P.]

Okay, so my feeling about Greek/Latin was right. I don't know them, but catch a word or two, the rest is deduction. :P

 

 

[Doe]

She is like devil from devil's advocate. (John Milton)

 

She is using people's will and even playing with them.

 

I like characters who give someone pause for thought.