Episode 4.2 "The Lying Detective"

[Pseudonym]

Oh God, I hadn't noticed the blood on the floor. This scene still kills me, I hate it just as much as when I first ranted about it :(

 

[BLS_Pro]

Are you referring to the various references to premonitions? I think that was just another bit of foreshadowing ... not even Sherlock Holmes can foresee where every thread will lead.

The premonition in T6T wasn't a premonition at all.  It was Sherlock's subconscious connecting "water" (drowning/death) with Thatcher - which is a connection to Hounds, which is the case identical to his own repressed and corrupted memories.

[Inge l-w]

That wasn't premonition of any kind. His repeated comments in both TST and TLD about all strands of human interaction mixing together to form a whole that could then be predicted as accurately as mathematics is just good old professor Isaac Asimov ( also a chemist, as it so happens), in his famous Second Foundation series, cited by the main character, Hari Seldon.

Why bother to come up with your own ideas, when you can so easily borrow someone else's original work?

[Arcadia]

Asimov didn't invent it either, you know.

[Inge l-w]

Dear Arcadia, Asimov was a professor at a very prestigious university. Some mathematics genius or other created the theory, either in probabilities, large numbers or even General Relativity. But Asimov used it as a literary device. Can you really, really, see the creative duo delving into tomes of mathematic formulas? They couldn't have written the script of the Imitation Game if their lives depended on it!

[Bubu]

I'm rewatching the whole series and there's a little thing I've noticed in His Last Vow. The carpet Janine is lying on in Magnussen's office looks like the one in the therapist's room.

I'm not reading anything into it, of course, just a funny little detail that I noticed. I made a few snapshots:

 

 

 

Edited January 28, 2017 by Arcadia
Removed spoiler boxes, not needed

[J.P.]

Hah! Well spotted! In TLD it looks like a caw skin dyed red. The one in CAM office is hardly visible, but  it could be the same. :D

[Arcadia]

Yes, nice catch, Bubu! Just to make it easier for everyone to see them, I removed the spoiler boxes, you don't have to use them in the "spoiler" threads.

Before I looked at the pictures ... I thought you were going to say the rug was made out of an Irish Setter's hide ... I've definitely been hanging around this fandom too long.......

[Pseudonym]

A tiny little dog hide rug. :D

[BLS_Pro]

Perhaps it is the hide of the HOUND.  ;)

[Pseudonym]

*GASP*  :o

[Redbeard]

Ah yes, I forgot about the note too. Although I think we've been talking about two different notes here, so let me address them one at a time.

 

John's note: the way the scene was constructed, I took Molly's words to be a summation of what was in the note. Sherlock didn't need to read it then, because Molly was already telling him the gist of it. There wasn't any point to the note, really, which is too bad, because why call attention to it if you're not going to use it? Sometimes I think Moftiss doesn't even watch their own program.

 

Faith's note: according to Sherlock's deduction, it had been hidden away for awhile, but then posted where the sunlight could reach it for a few years. Posted by whom? We saw ... and I assume it was real ... that Smith took it away from Faith the same evening she wrote it. Why he didn't then destroy it boggles my imagination, but I don't know how serial killers think ... maybe he thought it was a neat souvenir. At any rate, I'm guessing he's the one who hid it in a book for a long time, causing the sharp crease.

 

But then it gets taken out of the book and posted on a wall in a small kitchen by someone who lives alone and doesn't have many visitors. Is that supposed to be Faith? The real Faith? She's got a billionaire father who dotes on her, she's not estranged from him ... so why would she be living, isolated, in such a place? So is it someone else who has the note?

 

I thought it was going to turn out to be Euros who somehow got hold of it, but then we find out she's living in a windowless cell in Sherrinford. Or has she been loose in London all this time, and Mycroft never found out? Maybe.....

 

Then I thought maybe Moriarty was somehow involved, but they never went anywhere with him either other than to say he and Eurus met once.

 

So ... still baffled about who exactly had the note all that time, and how Eurus ended up with it. Given all that, I don't even care anymore how she found out what it meant.

 

Frack. This was well on its way to becoming one of my all time favorite episodes, and now it has this glaring plot hole. Hellllp meeeeee!!!!!

 

Interesting thoughts regarding Faith's note...I agree Smith was the one that hid it in a book.  But then I think the person who posted it on a wall in a small kitchen who gets no visitors (etc.) is Euros, not Faith.   I would imagine she would be able to take semi-regular jaunts to London and maybe the Governor had arranged a place for her to hole up when there.  It would likely be small, non-descript, isolated, etc.  It would probably be interesting to see what else Eurus had around such a place. I imagine newspaper clippings of Moriarty's exploits, files on Mycroft,  and a shrine to Sherlock, serial-killer style lol.   

[Arcadia]

That's a thought. Presumably she had somewhere to stay while she was in London. Urk, I wonder if there were any other unsolved murders during that time ......

[BLS_Pro]

Eurus tells Watson: "Did Sherlock ever tell you about the note?  I added some deductions for Sherlock.  He was quite good.  But he didn't get the big one."

In other words, Eurus is telling us she manufactured ("added") the clues for his deductions.  They weren't naturally occurring.  The note wasn't in the sunlight for a few years. It just appeared to have been.  It didn't have to be posted.  It didn't have to be in a book.  It didn't have to be in a kitchen.  She simply created the clues which would lead Sherlock to such conclusions - just as she created the "Miss Me?" clue on the note - and created the "Anyone" clue, etc.

[Arcadia]

And that's a thought too. I wondered exactly which clues she was supposed to have added, other than the Miss Me.

[Inge l-w]

Query to all fellow fans: At the end of TST, Sherlock AND Mrs Hudson sit down to watch Mary's video. Therefore, she must have known all along that her eccentric tenant would try to do something over the top to 'save John Watson'. Were all her actions in the flat part of their mutual plot to bring the two together again? Then, all her reactions in the therapist's house were simple acting on her part. Why?

Sorry in advance, dear Carol, but the Dancing Men seen at the end of TFP are just a transcription of 'Am here, Abe Slaney'. Teasing the animals, in this case the whole fandom, with inconclusive prompts has become bearable, but not bothering to invent a new cryptogram, just for fun, is plain lazy!

[Surelock]

Query to all fellow fans: At the end of TST, Sherlock AND Mrs Hudson sit down to watch Mary's video. Therefore, she must have known all along that her eccentric tenant would try to do something over the top to 'save John Watson'. Were all her actions in the flat part of their mutual plot to bring the two together again? Then, all her reactions in the therapist's house were simple acting on her part. Why?

 

I think it was more a mix of both.

 

Sherlock didn't immediately try to fulfill Mary's wishes. Mary told him to go pick a fight with a bad guy. However by the time Euros-Faith meets Sherlock it doesn't look like Sherlock has made an effort to go pick a fight with anyone. It looks like he's locked himself up in his flat and just drowned himself in drugs. It's also notable that Mrs. Hudson looks genuinely concerned when Sherlock leaves his flat with Euros-Faith. 

 

I'd say Mrs. Hudson wasn't sure of what exactly Sherlock had in mind. I think  everything Mrs. Hudson did to get Sherlock to John was more out of concern for Sherlock but also with a small glimmer of hope that Sherlock had something planned out to bring him and John back together.

[Bubu]

Well, she is not "a civilian" ;)

[Inge l-w]

Thanks, people! If she's not a civilian, she's indirectly MI5? Would they employ the widow of a drug baron who used to be an exotic dancer and still uses ' herbal soothers'?

And I do like how the Lady in Red mirrors Irene Adler: insanely dangerous, worse than a sociopath, but the ever chivalrous Mr Holmes gives her his dressing gown as temporary protection, the same way Irene got THE coat.

[Pseudonym]

I don't think she's not a civilian literally. She just means she understands Sherlock and been putting up with his crap for so long that she's not just some 'civilian' off the streets. 

[Bubu]

Well, of course, that's how I understood it as well.

I certainly don't think she is employed by the secret services. This was her own initiative, I believe, like Surelock said, out of concern for Sherlock.

[Inge l-w]

Sorry, but is it just me and my Sherlockian imagination, or is Culverton Smith directly referring to Prince Albert, one of the main suspects in the Jack the Ripper case, looping back to Anderson's sick little joke in TEH?

[Artemis]

The other thing that bothers me, which I would imagine most people either didn't notice or shrugged off, is the whole Irene Adler conversation, where John tries to cajole Sherlock into texting her back and having a relationship. Bear with me on this one. Now personally I've always viewed Sherlock as either gay or asexual (or a mix of both). Not everyone agrees with that, everyone has their own views and opinions on it, and that's fine. But I think what everyone can agree with is that Sherlock is not someone who is ever going to find a nice girl, settle down and start a family. He clearly isn't wired like everyone else, doesn't feel or view things the same way, and THAT IS OKAY. John knows that about him, has told him from the start that 'it's all fine.' Suddenly there is this pressure to be like everyone else. I know I brought a lot of my personal feelings into this little scene, that was meant to be throw away, but it also disturbed me to the point I thought if Sherlock suddenly admitted he had had a relationship with Irene, or that he would text her back in an attempt to start something, I don't know if I could accept it. I've always appreciated that Sherlock is Sherlock without needing to have a romantic interest, with his sexuality being kept ambiguous, and if that suddenly switched up and had him being a perfectly square, 'normal' heterosexual character it would really bother me. I can only imagine how gay people may have felt watching that scene, the entire opinion on Sherlock's sexuality has always been set by John from the first episode with his statement of 'everything is fine,' but now, because he's lost his wife, he's pressuring Sherlock into something, and for a horrible, horrible moment I thought it would happen. Again, to a lot of people watching that was scene was nothing, perhaps just friendly teasing, but I hated it almost as much as I hated the beating. Possibly not for what actually happened in it, but for the implication Sherlock would be 'better' if was involved with someone, that he wasn't 'whole' being alone, and that he 'should' text her back with the aim of instigating something. Luckily, though he said he had texted her, it didn't get into that, was left ambiguous, and for that I am thankful.

 

Yes.  I definitely noticed this, and it bothered me too.  As an asexual person I hear this type of thing frequently, and I don't appreciate the pressure or the implication that I am not "enough" outside of a sexual or romantic relationship.  It's dehumanizing, and I was irritated that John said it, though I'm sure in his case it was well-intended.

 

Furthermore, I would really hate to see Sherlock pigeonholed into a sexuality.  He's such an iconic and beloved character; he means a lot to a lot of different people.  I would prefer him to remain ambiguous and relatable for all people, not just one group.

 

 

[Pseudonym]

I'm glad I'm not the only one it bothered - and for similar reasons it seems. Just keep him ambiguous and people can read into it what they want.  

[Artemis]

As an aside, did anyone else think that, for a best friend, John's standards for Sherlock are appallingly low?  :P  "She likes you, and she's alive!  So what if she's a lunatic and a criminal and insanely dangerous?  She's there and she's currently breathing oxygen!  GO GET HER!!"

I'm paraphrasing, of course.  But only a little.


I've never cared much for BBC's Irene, personally.  I didn't feel she had all that much depth.  My interpretation of ACD was that Sherlock admired her not only for her intelligence, but also for her integrity; so I don't really care for adaptions where the integrity aspect is removed or unclear.