Episode 4.3 "The Final Problem"

[Alex the Dabbler]

Apparently one of the S4 episodes was going to be called "Backlash":

 

http://www.radiotimes.com/news/2017-02-02/mark-gatiss-almost-named-a-sherlock-episode-backlash-because-he-expected-an-outcry

[Boton]

I have come to the working conclusion that I am the only one in the fandom who is 95% happy with TFP specifically and S4 in general.  

[T.o.b.y]

I have come to the working conclusion that I am the only one in the fandom who is 95% happy with TFP specifically and S4 in general.  

 

Maybe that will change once my sodding DVDs have finally arrived and I've had a chance to see the new episodes as often as I have seen series 3, which I didn't much appreciate in the beginning either but now definitely love.

 

At the moment, I would say I'm about 80% satisfied with series 4. In my opinion, a lot of the storytelling could have been much better, but on the other hand, they got everything "right" that I considered really important and having a proper ending is really a huge gift for me.

 

[GregorysGirl]

It seems a lot of viewers believe that Moriarty was "programmed" by Eurus to make trouble for Sherlock.  But this doesn't really add up.

 

First of all, we know that Moriarty knew about Sherlock in 2010, the time of The Great Game.  It seems quite likely that he probably knew about Sherlock as far back as when Carl Powers was murdered by JM and Sherlock was the only one who knew Carl's death wasn't an accident, but couldn't get anyone to listen to him.

 

Second, the meeting between Moriarty and Eurus happened "five years ago", so either in 2012 or 2011, which places it chronologically after The Great Game.

 

Of course it would have been prior to The Reichenbach Fall but even still, the Moriarty/Eurus connection could only have been a "collaboration" at best.  After all, JM was a psychopath from birth.  He didn't need anyone to "program him" to go after Sherlock.

 

 

[Surelock]

A bigger question is why Moriarty never mentioned Euros.

 

He loved messing with Sherlock all the time. Why didn't he ever say something like 'I visited your psychopath sister in an asylum?'

[BLS_Pro]

It seems a lot of viewers believe that Moriarty was "programmed" by Eurus to make trouble for Sherlock.  But this doesn't really add up.

 

First of all, we know that Moriarty knew about Sherlock in 2010, the time of The Great Game.  It seems quite likely that he probably knew about Sherlock as far back as when Carl Powers was murdered by JM and Sherlock was the only one who knew Carl's death wasn't an accident, but couldn't get anyone to listen to him.

 

Second, the meeting between Moriarty and Eurus happened "five years ago", so either in 2012 or 2011, which places it chronologically after The Great Game.

 

Of course it would have been prior to The Reichenbach Fall but even still, the Moriarty/Eurus connection could only have been a "collaboration" at best.  After all, JM was a psychopath from birth.  He didn't need anyone to "program him" to go after Sherlock.

 

You had me up til "likely he probably knew about Sherlock as far back as...Carl Powers" - and "JM was a psychopath from birth".

 

As you say, however, there is no need to claim Moriarty was "programmed" by Eurus.  He was a psychopath before meeting her.  Their interests simply intersected.

 

[sfmpco]

I don't believe Eurus programmed Moriarty at all.  In fact, I think they were more like kindred spirits and that she simply consulted with him, much as Irene Adler did.  How to play the Holmes boys.  We don't know that she's running the place when she meets with Moriarty.  Clearly the glass is up.  She is running the place later, however.

 

I am not sure that Eurus is able to program anyone with a high intelligence, and that includes Moriarty.  As Sherlock admitted in TAB, "You have a magnificent brain, Moriarty.  I admire it.   I concede it may even be the equal of my own."  (yes, I know it was all in his mind palace, but this is what he THINKS) So I don't think her mental reprogramming skills had any effect on Mycroft, Sherlock or Moriarty.

 

She did, however, reprogram Sherlock by putting him through the trials.  She literally ripped open his heart in so many ways, eventually playing the same game she had played with him as a child but which he was too "slow" to understand at the time.  If he had figured out her game then, he could have saved his childhood friend.  That has to cause him some guilt.  Not being fast enough or smart enough.  I think part of her acting like Faith was to see in person just how far he had developed.  Could he figure out that case?  Some of the things he deduced about her were true and some who knows.  But she got enough information to know that he was ready to play her game.

[J.P.]

Something so obvious I haven't notice it at all.

 

 

• Moriarty: ey you, ehm... so how did you start?
• Eurus: well, I drowned a boy
• Moriarty: Me too! :DDD What a coincidence
• Eurus: lets have sex through this glass
• Moriarty: sure why not

 

Found here:

http://naturalshocks.tumblr.com/post/156793034963/moriarty-ey-you-ehm-so-how-did-you

[Arcadia]

We were talking about the scripts a few posts back ... JP discovered that the Series 1 scripts are online! Here's the link:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/writersroom/scripts/sherlock

 

Thanks JP!

 

Annnnnd the amazing JP also found the HLV shooting script! http://www.emmys.com/sites/default/files/Downloads/Sherlock_Ep3_Script.pdf

 

 

It just occurred to me to wonder what Eurus would have done if all three of them had decided to just sit on the floor and do nothing. Pretend to crash the plane, I guess.

 

I had the same thought while I was watching it.  I was also fully expecting him to turn the gun on himself.  It's what I would have done, if doing nothing didn't work.  He was the focus of her "experiments", it wasn't going to end until he took himself out of the study.  I remember saying to my dog, "He should turn the gun on himself.  She won't like that."

 

 

​Yes, to me that was the obvious solution, I was surprised that Eurus reacted as if she didn't expect it. But she did have the darts ready. So maybe the suddenness with which Sherlock started to carry it out was what seemed to catcy her offguard?

 

Apparently one of the S4 episodes was going to be called "Backlash":

 

http://www.radiotimes.com/news/2017-02-02/mark-gatiss-almost-named-a-sherlock-episode-backlash-because-he-expected-an-outcry

 

Which one?

 

I don't believe Eurus programmed Moriarty at all.  In fact, I think they were more like kindred spirits and that she simply consulted with him, much as Irene Adler did.  How to play the Holmes boys.  We don't know that she's running the place when she meets with Moriarty.  Clearly the glass is up.  She is running the place later, however.

 

I am not sure that Eurus is able to program anyone with a high intelligence, and that includes Moriarty.  As Sherlock admitted in TAB, "You have a magnificent brain, Moriarty.  I admire it.   I concede it may even be the equal of my own."  (yes, I know it was all in his mind palace, but this is what he THINKS) So I don't think her mental reprogramming skills had any effect on Mycroft, Sherlock or Moriarty.

 

She did, however, reprogram Sherlock by putting him through the trials.  She literally ripped open his heart in so many ways, eventually playing the same game she had played with him as a child but which he was too "slow" to understand at the time.  If he had figured out her game then, he could have saved his childhood friend.  That has to cause him some guilt.  Not being fast enough or smart enough.  I think part of her acting like Faith was to see in person just how far he had developed.  Could he figure out that case?  Some of the things he deduced about her were true and some who knows.  But she got enough information to know that he was ready to play her game.

[Artemis]

Did anyone notice that when Mycroft was retching after seeing the governor kill himself in TFP, Sherlock looked at him, and then turned to John and asked if he was okay?  I just thought that was funny.  No comfort for Mycroft, poor Mycroft, lol.

 

 

Edited February 4, 2017 by Arcadia
Moved from another thread ... spoiler

[bedelia1984]

Did anyone notice that when Mycroft was retching after seeing the governor kill himself in TFP, Sherlock looked at him, and then turned to John and asked if he was okay?  I just thought that was funny.  No comfort for Mycroft, poor Mycroft, lol.

 

Yes, but Sherlock was prepared to lay down his life for him in the end, so it wasn't all bad news for Mycroft.

 

I though the portrayal of the Sherlock/ Mycroft relationship was one of the highlights of the whole episode actually. Both of them are willing to die for the other. And Mycroft would even rather die than have Sherlock kill John. It's all very sweet, really.

[Artemis]

I agree!

 

 

[BLS_Pro]

She did, however, reprogram Sherlock by putting him through the trials. 

I have qualms about using the term reprogramming in this regard.  By this usage, almost any act or interaction with a person is an act of "reprogramming" them.

[sfmpco]

I said she didn't reprogram him by mental ability only but by putting him to task.  She broke his shell and thereby his control, which allowed the memories to come back and the floodgates of emotion.  He was not able to play her game until she broke him.

[Arcadia]

Sfmpco, I think I agree with what you say, but ... why did he have to feel emotions, to remember the past, to play the game? Because it seems to me that what happened next was he solved the riddle of the song and the gravestones ... and I can't figure out how his emotional state, or his memories, factor into that. What are your thoughts on this?

[MycroftsUmbrella]

t just occurred to me to wonder what Eurus would have done if all three of them had decided to just sit on the floor and do nothing. Pretend to crash the plane, I guess.

 

But I think that would be my choice in that situation. Somehow, letting someone else crash a plane seems less worse to me than choosing to shoot yourself in front of your best friend. Less personal, I guess. I suppose that makes me rather shallow. ;)

 

It's what I think I would have done as well. Does that make me shallow too?  ;)  I personally think it's the more common reaction and the fact that the three of them tried to help and considered killing one of theirs rather than all those people make them somewhat special. Sadly most people don't really care unless it's personal, otherwise it's too much tragedy to cope with after all. I would have loved to see the scene, to be honest. All of them sitting down on the floor in protest, legs crossed meditating position almost, totally ignoring Eurus. It wouldn't have made for a very good episode, I suppose but I can see it playing out in my head so well, but then I have a very vivid imagination.

 

But it is interesting to think about the motivation of the three of playing the game. I mean Mycroft was genuinely more worried that the plane, which he assumed was real, could crash into some crowded place or maybe an important government building. He didn't seem to care very much about either the girl or the people on the plane and just to keep it away from the public. At least that's what I got from his suggestion to deliberately crash the plane in the sea or an area where no one else would die. It's a bit cold, but in his role of protecting national security it makes absolute sense to do just that. Kill a few to protect the wellbeing of the many.

 

Then there is John, the good hearted one. He genuinely cared about the girl and the people on the plane as well as the safety of possible others if the plane crashed. I think given the way his character was established previously, acting any ther way would have felt wrong for him. Sacrificing himself for that sort of thing seems very much him.

 

But I can't fully figure out Sherlock's motivation though: Did he care more about the girl or the fact there were lots of people on the plane? Or both? Unlike Mycroft he placed the lives of the girl/ people on the plane over the many people who could have died if they failed to land the plane safely. He seemed genuinely appaled about Mycroft's suggestion to just guide the girl to crash it and kill both herself and everyone on it. He's not usually one for caring about other people (apart from his friends) so his direct concern for the girl and empathic way of talking to her initially felt really out of character to me. After that he definitely can't claim that he is a sociopath anymore, unless it was just a very good act. But if he really was he wouldn't have considered killing either Mycroft or John, as that wouldn't be in his personal interest. It shows that he has come along way since season 1 though and I do like that he seemed to understand and use emotions a lot more in dealing with the situation. My guess is he wanted to help so badly because he could somehow genuinely identify with her as well and maybe because he liked the challenge of trying to help her and 'solve the case' as well. But if anyone has any other ideas I'd love ot hear them.

[Arcadia]

Maybe Sherlock didn't want to choose between saving the people on the ground or saving the people on the plane ... he wanted to find a way to save both, if possible?

[sfmpco]

Sfmpco, I think I agree with what you say, but ... why did he have to feel emotions, to remember the past, to play the game? Because it seems to me that what happened next was he solved the riddle of the song and the gravestones ... and I can't figure out how his emotional state, or his memories, factor into that. What are your thoughts on this?

 

I don't know that he had to specifically feel emotions to remember the past -  but here's where TAB comes more into play than one would think.  Remember his little conversation with Watson:Eu

 

From Ariane Devere's transcript:

 

WATSON: As your friend – as someone who ... worries about you – what made you like this?

HOLMES: Oh, Watson. Nothing made me.

(From somewhere to his left, scrabbling claws can be heard together with a sound of a dog whimpering anxiously, or as if it is in pain. Holmes turns his head in the direction of the sound.)

HOLMES: I made me.

(The scrabbling and whimpering continues. Holmes frowns in confusion.)

HOLMES: Redbeard?

 

Two things of importance - 1) his admission that he made himself.  This is a subconscious admission that perfectly dovetails Mycroft's words in TFP of "Every choice you ever made; every path you've ever taken - the man you are today is your memory of Eurus."  Sherlock rewrote his own memories, something that is echoed in TST when Mycroft mentions that Sherlock rewrote the story of the Merchant of Samarra to have a better ending.  Sherlock has written a different memory regarding a dog instead of a best friend.  And he lost the dog.. although in TFP it makes it seem like the dog was drowned but in HLV is the mind palace line, "Hello, Redbeard.  They're putting me down too, now.  It's no fun, is it?"  This line makes it seem as if the dog was put to sleep, which is either a story inconsistency or that Sherlock had even rewritten that part of his memory to deal with the loss of the imaginary dog. So really, all the locked up, pent up emotions he feels are because of the lies he told himself to cover the truth - even the truth about his sister.  He blotted her out of his mind, likely because he knew the truth but it was too much to bear.  Interesting in MHR when he says, "Only lies have detail."  How true that is of how he rewrote his memories.  Notice also that in the TAB quote above it seems to imply that Redbeard is trapped somewhere and clawing to get out.  Of course this is his drug-addled mind palace but it seems to imply a different ending for Redbeard than just that he was put down.

 

2.  When he first meets Eurus at her cell, she can see that he is still mentally blocked...so blocked that he can't see the obvious - that there is no glass in her cell to keep her in.  She wants to play with him, but she can't fully do that if he can't remember the truth.

 

Eurus lacks empathy although she is not totally without emotional context herself.  She experiences the fear of being alone in her supreme intelligence.  But she also has pity on Sherlock that he has blocked out the truth.  I suspect she knows that she is about to have a complete mental breakdown, but she also needs Sherlock to solve that puzzle she left for him as a child.  If he had solved it as a child and had then gone to her room, she likely wouldn't have set the place of fire and would have told him where to find his friend.  

  

The truth is locked up in Sherlock, and part of his maintaining control is to keep that truth locked up.  He won't let sentiment or love, or anything breach that lock, because then the buried truth will come out.  In a way, that's the true final problem - the unlocking of Sherlock.  It is a parting gift to him from her, but to unlock him, she has to push all his buttons, his pressure points.  Even Sherlock admits that what she is putting him through is vivisection.  She is not just cracking his shell but breaking it wide open and allowing the Sherlock that once was to live again.  I am always reminded of Moriary's line from TGG where he says, "I will burn the heart out of you" because I never felt he did that.  But Eurus is certainly doing it.  This time, solve the riddle of the headstones, save Eurus from killing Sherlock's best friend again.   She just wants to be loved and have a friend, and the gentle tenderness he shows her when he finds her in her old Musgrave room are the most kindness and tenderness he has perhaps show anyone in any of the episodes,  Eurus did that to him.  All the other people around him may have softened his edges some over the years, but Eurus broke him - and thereby fixed him.  Bad analogy, but he was in a cocoon and he emerged a butterfly.

 

8

 Eu

[gerry]

I said she didn't reprogram him by mental ability only but by putting him to task. She broke his shell and thereby his control, which allowed the memories to come back and the floodgates of emotion. He was not able to play her game until she broke him.

At what point did you think she broke him?

 

And each test in the cells were a pressure point? He didn't seem affected by the first two rooms that much so I don't know what pressure points those were supposed to be.

[sfmpco]

 

I said she didn't reprogram him by mental ability only but by putting him to task. She broke his shell and thereby his control, which allowed the memories to come back and the floodgates of emotion. He was not able to play her game until she broke him.

At what point did you think she broke him?

 

 

I think it was gradual, but certainly the coffin scene was a huge break, but then later realizing that it was his friend Victor who died because they never had a dog was the final break.  He was cracked wide open then, and there was no going back.  His memories had been unlocked.

[gerry]

 

 

 

I said she didn't reprogram him by mental ability only but by putting him to task. She broke his shell and thereby his control, which allowed the memories to come back and the floodgates of emotion. He was not able to play her game until she broke him.

At what point did you think she broke him?

I think it was gradual, but certainly the coffin scene was a huge break, but then later realizing that it was his friend Victor who died because they never had a dog was the final break. He was cracked wide open then, and there was no going back. His memories had been unlocked.

When Eurus said "you didn't win, you lost" I think is when I noticed the first real break. Everything Eurus said in that scene was telling.

[sfmpco]

I think also when Molly turned the tables on him and told him to say ILY first and he says it - not one but twice, the second te with feeling and meaning - yes, he did mean it - and him finally hearing the words from her lips in response.  Broke him open.  He'd never said ILY to anyone in the show.  Not anyone.  It's not just that I ship it but that the ship had been sailing strongly since S3.  Even Loo said, "Something happened in the last season (3), and now we no longer laughed at the idea that yes,  something could happen between them (Sherlock and Molly)."

 

I'm not going to battle that ship here, but for him to say the words ILY were not just manipulation.  Not at all.  Oh, and she is wearing a thin gold ring on her ring finger when she enters 221B at the end.  Yes she is.  And she's heading happily in Sherlock's direction.

[bedelia1984]

sfmpco do you have any links to a picture of that ring? Or how did you see it?

[sfmpco]

sfmpco do you have any links to a picture of that ring? Or how did you see it?

 

I'm waiting for someone with a blue ray player to be able to capture the image.  I saw it on a slowed down DVR recording.  Plain as day.

[bedelia1984]

 

sfmpco do you have any links to a picture of that ring? Or how did you see it?

 

I'm waiting for someone with a blue ray player to be able to capture the image.  I saw it on a slowed down DVR recording.  Plain as day.

 

 

Cool, well if you do get a pic, don't be a stranger over here!