The Language (and travel) Thread

[Carol the Dabbler]

You're still way ahead of me! I wouldn't even be able to post the URL -- but that's due to my own ineptitude rather than any electronic anomaly.

[Arcadia]

I haven't read that article yet, but nope, that's simply what 400 years of separation can do, especially if the separation begins during an era of rapid linguistic change. (We did intentionally change our spelling, but that's another story.)

We did? I thought that was just because Webster couldn't spell! :D

Could one of the other mods please make that into a live link, for those of us who don't yet know how to copy-and-paste on our cellphones?

Done!

[Arcadia]

By the way, that's a fascinating website. I just wasted spent a good 20 minutes reading different articles there. Thanks a heap, Shadow! <_<

[J.P.]

Just because there was a confusion about one of my recent posts:

By surf-stick I indeed meant... I think it's called UMTS modem... this little thingy you put a SIM card into and you can go online with your computer using the mobile network.

 

Well, welcome to the amazing world of anglicisms! :D

 

The most popular one in Germany is the term handy, which means mobile phone/cellphone. (hand -> handy, got it?)

Then there is an USB flash drive called USB Stick in Germany, but pendrive in Poland.

I remember years ago trying to discuss computers with someone from Poland and giving up after two sentences because we couldn't understand each other. :D

[Caya]

This video is definitely NOT safe for work acustically (though it may leave HR more baffled than anything else), but if you ever wanted to hear some wildly original Scottish insults, enjoy:

 

[Arcadia]

I usually can't stand Samantha B but that was hysterical!

[J.P.]

Maybe someone here can help me:

Is the native language of Scotland and Wales the same (Gaelic)?

Are there actually any rules on reading the written version? Because for me it seems that the written words have nothing to do with their spoken equivalents.

[SherlockedCAMPer]

Nope Welsh and Scottish are very much different. There is no 1 correct way of spelling Scottish words according to something my sister read or watched recently.

[Carol the Dabbler]

They're definitely different, but I believe they are related -- sort of like French and Spanish.  When we were visiting Wales, I was somewhat bewildered by the road signs (which are in Welsh first, then English), especially I had no idea whatsoever how to pronounce the Welsh.

 

I looked through a book in a tourist shop, though, and discovered that Welsh seems to be a typical Indo-European language.  It's just spelt funny, because the spelling didn't evolve over centuries.  The spelling was invented, and the inventor was determined that it would be perfectly phonetic and that it would use the standard Roman alphabet (same as English) -- which meant that some letters had to be used in creative ways.  So the "w" is a vowel, for example, and sounds more or less like a "u."  I'm still at a loss to pronounce much of it, though.

[SherlockedCAMPer]

The 3 Celtic languages are indeed related to each other. I googled a Welsh pronunciation guide once. The W and Y have different ways of being pronounced depending on if they are paired together or not and when separate, where they are in the word.

The person who wrote the guide was a professor at Cambridge and lead a walking club that went to Wales periodically.

[J.P.]

Hehe... perfectly phonetic. It's a perfect joke. I always have to laugh at the line: you say it just like you write it. You would be surprised. :D

[Carol the Dabbler]

Hehe... perfectly phonetic. It's a perfect joke. I always have to laugh at the line: you say it just like you write it. You would be surprised. :D

There was a running gag on the Barney Miller TV show, where Wojciehowicz would tell someone that his name was spelt "just like it sounds."

 

Also, a friend of ours named Gardner said "just like it sounds" when placing an order over the phone, not taking into account that he has a Boston accent and the person he was speaking to did not. The package arrived addressed to "Godna."

 

However, it's my impression that Welsh really is pronounced like it's spelt -- if you know the rules. (Anyone from Wales may feel free to set me straight.)

[J.P.]

Wojciehowicz? Well, if he isn't an immigrant in 1. or 2. generation, he might be surprised how I would pronounce his name!

[Carol the Dabbler]

The character on the show pronounced it as "woh-juh-HOH-witz," if that answers your question. How would you say it?

[J.P.]

Voy-tie-kho-vitch

[Carol the Dabbler]

Oh my! Then I'm guessing his family has been over here for a while.

 

And compared to that, he really *does* spell it (more or less) like it sounds, at least by American phonetic standards.

[besleybean]

Forgot I'm supposed to pay attention to this thread!

I speak some Welsh and a bit of  Scottish Gaelic.

 

Yes, as has been said: Welsh is a separate language.

The reason there is confusion is because the historic language of Brythonic Celt was Welsh and was spoken is South West Scotland. 

The Welsh are  Celtic peoples...but this just really means the earliest people who were all over the British Isles.

 

Scottish Gaelic developed from Irish Gaelic. They are alike, but slightly different.

The word itself ls GAYLICK  in the Irish version.

BUT GALL LICK in the Scottish one.

[J.P.]

ETA:

"tie" not like Mycroft's red tie, but Scottie and the T is very soft, but I don't find anything to describe it in what I think is a phonetic English standard :P

 

Thanks for the info on languages.

[Carol the Dabbler]

"tie" not like Mycroft's red tie, but Scottie and the T is very soft, but I don't find anything to describe it in what I think is a phonetic English standard :P

 

We'd generally write that as "tee" for the vowel sound. Sorry, can't help you with the soft T.

[Carol the Dabbler]

My brother criticized me for saying "snuck" (as the past tense of "sneak"). I claimed that it's perfectly fine in casual conversation, and both Merriam-Webster and Oxford agree. They also both stated that "sneaked" is the original past tense, and that the Irregular form "snuck" is of fairly recent origin.

 

That part didn't surprise me too much, but then they pointed out that "snuck" doesn't seem to be based on any other Irregular verb, and now that they mention it, I can't think of any. It isnt creak-cruck or leak-luck -- so why does sneak-snuck sound so natural? Any ideas?

[Arcadia]

Well, there's "strike/struck"; but I can't think of anything else and don't see how that helps much. I think it sounds natural to me simply because I've always heard it.

[Carol the Dabbler]

I suspect you're right about familiarity.

 

While I was falling asleep last night, I came up with a bunch of partial matches -- but darned if I can remember more than a couple of them now! I need to make a list and see if there's a pattern.

[Arcadia]

How about speak/spoke?

Hey, lookee what I found .... a list of irregular verbs. Any help? https://englishbyluka.files.wordpress.com/2013/07/english-irregular-verbs-list.jpg

[Carol the Dabbler]

Thanks! I'll check that out sometime when I'm awake.

[T.o.b.y]

I have never said "sneaked". It may be correct, but it sounds odd to me.