Episode 3.1, "The Empty Hearse"

[Carol the Dabbler]

Moftiss seem to have very little self control when it comes to cute gags (and/or canon references).  I just said somewhere that "Last Vow" may not reward close examination.  Perhaps I should have said Series 3. 

 

[sfmpco]

I'm glad I don't really know canon references because I just can enjoy it for whatever it is... and boy howdy do I enjoy it, and season 3 is my fav with season 2 very close behind.  

[T.o.b.y]

Okay , here's another TEH conundrum - Anderson's version of the survival of the fall had Sherlock kissing Molly.  Why would he come up with that?  Did he know how Molly felt?  He knew she supposedly laid out his body in the morgue but that doesn't imply anything else.  Of course, I know that kiss was put in for the fandom, period.  Still, interesting that that would be part of his story.

 

I think it was pretty obvious how Molly felt... Anderson's theory shows that he seems to have turned Sherlock into some kind of a Bond-like action hero in his mind. I think that's hilarious.

 

[Carol the Dabbler]

Hmm, yeah, even though I don't recall ever seeing Anderson in Molly's bailiwick, he surely had frequent cause to go there.  And if he happened to mention Sherlock (scathingly, of course), Molly would surely have jumped to his defense -- which could have given Anderson a hint!

 

[sfmpco]

Amazing how many scenarios of unwritten back-stories we can come up with to force explanations! 

[sfmpco]

Does anyone know if there are any production pics of BC with the long hair from the torture/beating scene?  i don't mean stills taken from the episode.  Something behind the scenes.

[Bakerstreet Irregular]

I haven't seen anything yet.

[by the sea]

Personally, I love this episode.    I think I might even change my "favourite" line in the signature here 'cause TEH just tickles my fancy.  Showcase network had this on this past Sunday as its early afternoon movie.  I have a very large soft spot for John, or maybe it's Mr. Freeman ... I simply enjoy his reactions so much.  I "feel" what John feels.  I don't know if it's because we have similar personalities or Mr. Freeman is so skilled at making me believe we do.  The expression on his face each time he tries to "kill" Sherlock has me shaking with laughter.  Of course, I have to admit being equally chuffed by Sherlock's face, battered though it is, when Mary says to him "you know absolutely nothing about human nature, do you ?".

 

The crime story is silly ... the terrorist bomb being a rather ridiculous diversion ... "Of course, there's an off switch !" but we get to see that even "death" can't change Sherlock and we meet Mary and get a little taste of CAM ... it's all good.  

 

Debbie

[Arcadia]

Does anyone know if there are any production pics of BC with the long hair from the torture/beating scene?  i don't mean stills taken from the episode.  Something behind the scenes.

Not a production pic, but I saw a photo of him & Gatiss posing with the actor who played the "torturer." (The hair was pretty crazy!) I haven't a clue how to find it again, sorry. Maybe look up the name of the actor who played that scene, and google it?

[Bakerstreet Irregular]

Not a great picture...not large enough imo

 

 

   

[Arcadia]

Yeah, that's the same one I saw, good detective work!

[jesskayding]

Wow. That looks a hot mess!

[Caya]

Bigger version:

 

[Bakerstreet Irregular]

Yay! You're a life saver, Martina.

[sfmpco]

I knew it had to be out there somewhere!!!

[Arcadia]

If I met those three in a dark alley I'd run for my life.....

[sfmpco]

Run like Moriarty is chasing you and like BC is in front of you.  LOL

[sherlockandjohn]

My all time favorite scene of all the episodes:

 

When John looks @ Sherlock with so much emotion, upon revealing himself in that restaurant. All the groans between each line as he was expressed the pain & betrayal he was feeling @ the time. That was class A acting.

 

 

The funniest scenes so far is in this episode to me... I loved that he just kept beating him up. He was still steaming in bed w/ Mary.

 

I loved this episode. LOved it!

 

Yup, that reunion scene is deeply emotional and wonderfully preposterous!

 

Strangely enough, I also laughed the most during this episode. For me, the scene that did it was when John grabbed his patient's hair, because he thought the man was Sherlock in disguise

 

I am also in love with this episode. Never mind that the fall explanation doesn't entirely hold up under scrutiny - I stick to the overall explanation and ignore the details that don't quite fit - it is one of the most emotionally compelling episodes for me.

[sfmpco]

Found this little gem...

 

[sfmpco]

Here's another wonderful gem - nice to know that the ONLY legit twitter account is @The_Whip_Hand, which was created the day ASIB came out.  

 

[Carol the Dabbler]

If you're looking for the discussion of Martin Freeman's other roles, we now have a new thread, "Favorite Freeman Performances."

[T.o.b.y]

I'm all for alternate universes (I'd move to Middle Earth in a heartbeat if I could) but it's always nice when they obey their own internal logic. I was just over in the thread where everyone was moaning about the solution to the Fall. The reason we struggle with that is because it seems to violate the internal logic of the show, by changing the rules from one season to the next. In TRF we're shown a Sherlock who appears to be beaten, uncertain and in tears. In TEH we find out it was all an act. In other words, they tossed out the rules they showed us in TRF ("this is a story about Sherlock heroically resorting to a desperate act of sacrifice") and replaced them with new rules in TEH ("sorry, actually this is a story about how clever Sherlock and Mycroft were.") Inventive, perhaps, but also a bit, uh ... underhanded?

 

Well, there is no proof in The Reichenbach Fall that we were actually seeing the kind of story a lot of us thought, and there were plenty of hints that something fishy was going on. Also, considering how brilliant Mycroft and Sherlock are, it does seem more realistic in a way that they made an elaborate plan to defeat Moriarty than that they just let him muck about and desperately tried to catch up with him...

 

As for Sherlock crying, well, that was always pretty clearly no more than an act, I think. But there are other instances in The Reichenbach Fall where he seems genuinely distressed, also when nobody is watching. And I don't think they meant to imply Molly was fooled as well when she pointed out that Sherlock looked sad when he thought John wasn't watching. And even Mr Moffat has stated that Sherlock's emotion when he goes to Molly for help is supposed to be real. So. Something was not good. Something was getting to Sherlock. And if everything was going so well according to his brother's plan and everything was under control, then what, pray, was it?

 

This is just one of the many questions raised by the last episode of series 2 that is never answered (as far as I know). There are plenty of others. I don't feel so much that the internal logic of the show has been violated (I don't think it has), but the story has simply not been completely told. It's unfinished, and that bothers me a lot. I don't need every little detail cleared up, but, like John, I would like to know why, and that why has not been addressed in the least, if you ask me.

[sherlockandjohn]

 

I'm all for alternate universes (I'd move to Middle Earth in a heartbeat if I could) but it's always nice when they obey their own internal logic. I was just over in the thread where everyone was moaning about the solution to the Fall. The reason we struggle with that is because it seems to violate the internal logic of the show, by changing the rules from one season to the next. In TRF we're shown a Sherlock who appears to be beaten, uncertain and in tears. In TEH we find out it was all an act. In other words, they tossed out the rules they showed us in TRF ("this is a story about Sherlock heroically resorting to a desperate act of sacrifice") and replaced them with new rules in TEH ("sorry, actually this is a story about how clever Sherlock and Mycroft were.") Inventive, perhaps, but also a bit, uh ... underhanded?

 

Well, there is no proof in The Reichenbach Fall that we were actually seeing the kind of story a lot of us thought, and there were plenty of hints that something fishy was going on. Also, considering how brilliant Mycroft and Sherlock are, it does seem more realistic in a way that they made an elaborate plan to defeat Moriarty than that they just let him muck about and desperately tried to catch up with him...

 

As for Sherlock crying, well, that was always pretty clearly no more than an act, I think. But there are other instances in The Reichenbach Fall where he seems genuinely distressed, also when nobody is watching. And I don't think they meant to imply Molly was fooled as well when she pointed out that Sherlock looked sad when he thought John wasn't watching. And even Mr Moffat has stated that Sherlock's emotion when he goes to Molly for help is supposed to be real. So. Something was not good. Something was getting to Sherlock. And if everything was going so well according to his brother's plan and everything was under control, then what, pray, was it?

 

This is just one of the many questions raised by the last episode of series 2 that is never answered (as far as I know). There are plenty of others. I don't feel so much that the internal logic of the show has been violated (I don't think it has), but the story has simply not been completely told. It's unfinished, and that bothers me a lot. I don't need every little detail cleared up, but, like John, I would like to know why, and that why has not been addressed in the least, if you ask me.

 

 

I also cannot believe that every emotion of Sherlock's in 'Reichenbach' was fake. How utterly ridiculous that would be! When Sherlock explains that he and his brother cooked up a plan, he says that he had to sit back and watch Moriarty discredit him. That in itself could be annoying. To wonder if John was buying into Moriarty's game would hurt and frustrate Sherlock. Then, he explains that there were 13 likely outcomes of the rooftop scenario. 13! Not just one. Imagine how many scenarios there must have been from the beginning, when Sherlock and Mycroft started to plan Moriarty's downfall. No way they could have foreseen everything from the start. When Sherlock finally says that their plan worked out perfectly, I assume he's referring to the actual fall - not to the entire plan from start to finish. We don't even know that they had an exact plan, just that they had to allow the destruction of Sherlock's reputation in order to make Moriarty believe that he had defeated Sherlock. What they planned to do next is uncertain, except they must have intended to "strike" just when Moriarty thought he was on top of his game.

 

Which raises another question: If Moriarty hadn't shot himself, how did Sherlock and Mycroft intend to proceed with their plans of bringing down their nemesis?

 

Indeed, 'Hearse' leaves us with a lot of questions and room for speculation. Not sure if it's a curse or a gift.

 

[jesskayding]

Yeah I never thought his emotions were fake. Even though he didn't commit suicide, he sort of did. No more London & John for 2 years. That's sad. He was going on a mission that was really dangerous. He could have really died during that time.

[T.o.b.y]

Yup, that reunion scene is deeply emotional and wonderfully preposterous!

 

Mhm, the moment in the restaurant where John first realizes that the waiter is Sherlock is one of those where I always thought "Martin Freeman deserves a medal for this".

 

Well, now at least he got an award. Not for The Empty Hearse (or the Reichenbach Fall, for that matter - come on, the graveside speech, that should have been acknowledged big time!), but at least he got one.